Which franchise really started the Modern setting for FPS'

[excaliburps]

Hey,

 

Earlier in the day, I had a quick chat with Patrick Liu (DICE Producer) who remarked that Modern Warfare is getting most, if not all the credit for the big transition from WWII FPS' to the modern era. He was not dissing the game by any means, but rightfully acknowledge that BF2 did it first.

 

I told him MW might have been the first to use the modern setting in its SP, which he pointed out that BF2:MC for the PS2 did it way back in 2005. Then, someone chimed in Delta Force. Which was an old PC game.

 

Anyhoo, long story short, I told Liu that this makes for an interesting topic and that I'll write up something about it.

 

Anyone here who knows a couple of things about it and wants to help out? I'll most probably tackle both SP and MP going the modern route.

 

Oh, and I'll also include the fact that BF2 was the first game to introduce stat-progression unlocks in a MP game if I'm not mistaken.

 

Any help would be appreciated. If you can help, hope there's a source material that I can work with as well for authentication. Not doubting any of you but having sources in black and white would help a lot.

 

One last thing, this won't appear on gamrFeed but on a new site which I got hired for. Cheers!

[Strangelove]

I didnt start playing fps games til the PS3 generation, so I dont know that much about them historically besides Doom. I had Timesplitters 3, but I didnt care for it. Ive tried really hard not to play them for some reason. I dont know why. I just...dont find them that fun....besides the exceptions like Half Life, Team Fortress 2 and Killzone games.

 

So yeah....I have nothing to contribute to this at all. Sorry.

[Hot Heart]

It seems to be the case that something which 'popularises' something isn't always necessarily the first.

 

People might point to Gears of War for cover systems and Halo for regenerating health/shields, but they probably weren't the first. You'd have to look at a case-by-case setting for where developers are drawing their references.

 

Couple that with the fact that you need to examine if this 'modern setting' is all that CoD is apparently inspiring. Seems people are more interested in these rollercoaster ride sort of shooting galleries with scripted events and such.

 

I'm no expert on FPSs because I only play the odd exception so, if I were to avoid sweeping generalisations, I couldn't pass judgement on a lot of what the industry is doing, but there have always been military games set in modern times; just not a lot of them go for the 'blockbuster' element like CoD. Seems quite a few are based on squad tactics and incorporate simulation elements (which seems more of a PC thing as of late).

[Pirandello]

I steadfastly believe that Battlefield 2 is what brought the "modern" setting to FPSs.

[Mr W Phallus]

Rainbow Six and Ghost Recon come to mind. According to wikipedia Full Spectrum Warrior (not an FPS I know, but still relevant I'd say) came out a year before Battlefield 2.

 

Some things that you might want to consider, whilst MW2 may not have 'invented' the modern warfare shooter it sure as hell popularised it, especially amongst what you might call the lay-gamers, as in the people who play video games but don't identify themselves as 'gamers' or 'hardcore gamers'. If you try and find some sort of measure of popularity - sales figures, ratings etc. - then you could get an indication of which game(s) everyone wanted to copy.

 

It would also be interesting to consider not just the games themselves but the publishers: Who has the most modern warfare shooters? Who was jumping on whose bandwagon? and so on.

 

Hope that helps. I don't have any sources more credible than wikipedia since most of these games are from before I really got into gaming.

[AgamemnonV2]

Saying MW2 popularized the "modern" setting is a bit like saying Halo popularized the sci-fi setting. I'm a little surprised that he didn't put forth Battlefield 2 as the titular game that did it. It was certainly the hit of its time and its competitors in Medal of Honor and Call of Duty followed suit shortly afterward. I specifically remember that much because the WWII titles in the years afterward (like Red Orchestra and Brothers in Arms were small fish titles and hailed by the WWII historical nuts as the "true" FPSes that did not make the switch to modern era).

 

However, note I say "popularized." The modern setting had always been well-known for shooters. SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs definitely comes to mind as a hit modern FPS title. Still, the hat goes off to Battlefield 2 for its massive online counterpart (as well as the whole "unlockables" phenomenon).

[MasterDex]

Yeah, I'd give a lot of credit to BF2 for bringing the modern setting to the FPS market, at least with the biggest impact but I think Counter Strike is the earliest FPS set in the modern day that I remember (but my memory is shit so I'm more than likely wrong). Modern Warfare owes alot to those two games.

[Mr W Phallus]

Saying MW2 popularized the "modern" setting is a bit like saying Halo popularized the sci-fi setting. I'm a little surprised that he didn't put forth Battlefield 2 as the titular game that did it. It was certainly the hit of its time and its competitors in Medal of Honor and Call of Duty followed suit shortly afterward. I specifically remember that much because the WWII titles in the years afterward (like Red Orchestra and Brothers in Arms were small fish titles and hailed by the WWII historical nuts as the "true" FPSes that did not make the switch to modern era).

 

However, note I say "popularized." The modern setting had always been well-known for shooters. SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs definitely comes to mind as a hit modern FPS title. Still, the hat goes off to Battlefield 2 for its massive online counterpart (as well as the whole "unlockables" phenomenon).

BF2, in my experience at least, was popular amongst 'gaming' crowds but didn't have the same impact amongst 'casual gamers'. MW reached a much larger audience thanks to it being released on consoles, whereas FPS gaming on the PC tends to be a bit more 'gamer' exclusive or hardcore.

 

Again this is just from my own experience, and could be specific to my age group or whatever. It is also possible that the rise of social networking has contributed to the increased popularity (both perceived and actual) of MW and CoD in general, what with all the CoD related statuses flying around facebook and so on. I also think gaming is generally accepted amongst a wider audience now, contributing to the apparent higher popularity of MW over the older BF2.

[AgamemnonV2]

Saying MW2 popularized the "modern" setting is a bit like saying Halo popularized the sci-fi setting. I'm a little surprised that he didn't put forth Battlefield 2 as the titular game that did it. It was certainly the hit of its time and its competitors in Medal of Honor and Call of Duty followed suit shortly afterward. I specifically remember that much because the WWII titles in the years afterward (like Red Orchestra and Brothers in Arms were small fish titles and hailed by the WWII historical nuts as the "true" FPSes that did not make the switch to modern era).

 

However, note I say "popularized." The modern setting had always been well-known for shooters. SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs definitely comes to mind as a hit modern FPS title. Still, the hat goes off to Battlefield 2 for its massive online counterpart (as well as the whole "unlockables" phenomenon).

BF2, in my experience at least, was popular amongst 'gaming' crowds but didn't have the same impact amongst 'casual gamers'. MW reached a much larger audience thanks to it being released on consoles, whereas FPS gaming on the PC tends to be a bit more 'gamer' exclusive or hardcore.

 

Again this is just from my own experience, and could be specific to my age group or whatever. It is also possible that the rise of social networking has contributed to the increased popularity (both perceived and actual) of MW and CoD in general, what with all the CoD related statuses flying around facebook and so on. I also think gaming is generally accepted amongst a wider audience now, contributing to the apparent higher popularity of MW over the older BF2.

I wouldn't attribute that to MW2 at all. Halo was the titular game that "generalized" gaming to bring in the "casuals." It sold the Xbox and therefore solidified its position. Halo 2 only reinforces that. Gears of War and the Modern Warfare/Call of Duty infighting were just riding the waves of that tsunami. Generally when I talk about that "casual" generation that popped up in 2004 I mention the "Halo generation."

[P4: Gritty Reboot]

I was playing BF2 before Modern Warfare came out, so yeah. I would put some credit towards that. However, Ghost Recon, Rainbow Six, and especially the R6: Rogue Spear games did the more realistic-leaning modern shooter far before any of them (and did it extremely well too.)

[CorgiShinobi]

I don't know much about the history of FPS games, because really, I didn't play a lot of them until this current (7th) generation. Sure I played GoldenEye 007, but that simply brought a great FPS multiplayer experience to home consoles.

 

I would say, as far as popularizing FPS games, Halo could possibly be the biggest influence. It was the one game that brought all the "bros" and jocks into gaming. For those groups, Modern Warfare was probably the game that brought the modern setting in FPS games. Of course, as what has been said, gamers have a better knowledge of previous FPS titles and so to them there is a much older game that brought forth a modern setting in the FPS genre.

Edited April 11, 2011 by Atomsk88

[Enervation]

I have to agree with Atomsk on Halo. Halo was almost literally the beginning of the modern FPS world as we know it. It was what brought ME into the FPS fold, too, and thats not even counting the almost legendary nature of Halo several months after it was released.

[MasterDex]

Yeah, Halo did harken in a bit of a revolution in FPS games alright....that said, I can't say I like what it's arguably most famous for bringing to the table = health regen. I still prefer when health doesn't regenerate and I feel multiplayer games are worse with health regen. With it, players are encouraged to go hide while they wait for their health to regenerate as opposed to being forced into moving to find a medkit or medic. It only exacerbates the problem of camping.

 

While Halo may have marked the beginning of the new era of FPS games, BF2 arguably marks the maturity of the era. It set so many standards that even now, developers are trying to catch up. Sure, much of what BF2 was had been done on some scale before but not quite like BF2 did it. Hell, even Dice haven't created a multiplayer game as good since (here's hoping BF3 changes that). Regardless, I don't think anyone could argue that BF2 gave birth to the much discussed multiplayer stats & unlocks mechanic that every multiplayer FPS these days seems to have....or maybe I'm forgetting a game that had it before BF2.

[Mr W Phallus]

I wouldn't attribute that to MW2 at all. Halo was the titular game that "generalized" gaming to bring in the "casuals." It sold the Xbox and therefore solidified its position. Halo 2 only reinforces that. Gears of War and the Modern Warfare/Call of Duty infighting were just riding the waves of that tsunami. Generally when I talk about that "casual" generation that popped up in 2004 I mention the "Halo generation."

Oh I totally agree, what I was trying to say was that because the first Modern Warfare benefited from the attention of the Halo generation (unlike the PC only BF2) I'd point to it as the game that made publishers say 'let's make our set our FPSes in a modern setting'.

 

Of course MW probably owes a lot to BF2 and other games, you really have to consider the whole history of modern era shooters, since you'll never find one definitive start point.

Edited April 11, 2011 by Mr W Phallus

[excaliburps]

Whoa! Didn't expect people to reply this soon and from the looks of it, I have my work cut out for me.

 

Should I count Counter-Strike? It's a mod.

 

I think BF2:MC was the first Modern setting FPS for consoles, correct? Anyone who would want to refute this?

 

PC is very, very tricky. Delta Force? Soldier of Fortune? Argh!

 

For stat-progression, I think BF2 really did start it all. Wiki, while sometimes inaccurate, seems to think the same way. Although the effect Modern Warfare 1 had and how it counts because it's the most popular should also be discussed.

 

Does Halo count or does it count for Future Warfare?

 

Long story short, keep the conversation going. I think I'll use some of the sentiments here...I also hope I don't get flayed to death when I write that article up as it will clearly be a controversial discussion. Here and in other forums where I've discussed it.

[deanb]

Counter strike is a mod that has sold a crap ton of copies and regularly tops Steams most played MP game stats. I think it's worth covering.

[Mr W Phallus]

I'd definitely count Counter-Strike, sure it's a mod but people still play CS and CS:S today, it's pretty influential in terms of multiplayer gaming.

 

I wouldn't count Halo as a modern warfare shooter but it could be worth mentioning the Halo generation, the console/PC divide and how that comes into play when considering the question at hand. For example, was MW simply bringing to consoles what BF2 (or another game) had already brought to the PC? Or is the current modern warfare market saturation simply a result of an increasingly commercial gaming industry brought about by a larger consumer base?

 

Here's a tricky one: does Goldeneye count as a modern warfare shooter?

 

At this point it seems like I'm giving you more questions instead of helping you find answers, so sorry for that.

[AgamemnonV2]

Counter strike is a mod that has sold a crap ton of copies and regularly tops Steams most played MP game stats. I think it's worth covering.

Counter-Strike probably wins for international exposure (in regards to ANY game, not just as an FPS). It's ridiculous how wide-spread Counter-Strike has gone (i.e. Brazil, Germany, Russia) to become popular. However, Counter-Strike is multiplayer only and it's pretty simple in concept.

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

I don't see how "simple in concept" is relevant. But yeah, that was the first "modern" online FPS I can remember and it certainly is popular and influential.

[excaliburps]

Yeah, I'll probably include Counter-Strike but most probably in the multiplayer aspect of the discussion.

 

I was in the way of thinking that the Modern setting exploded when MW1 came to the scene. The popularity it garnered seemed to push that game out in front of people's minds. While it might not be the first, people assume it is because it's the most popular one. But this same argument could be used for different things as well. I mean for PC, one could argue it was CS or BF2 that started the Modern MP FPS.

 

So in effect, it does look like the consoles are late to the party with BF2:MC which got released on 2005 for the PS2. I'm counting this one because it has both a Modern setting for the SP and MP. Again, does anyone care to refute this?

 

So far for the bare-bones discussion it looks like this.

 

PC: MP started with CS, BF2. Stat progression started with BF2.

Single-player-Delta Force? Solider of Fortune? (Very much want a clarification on this from the PC crowd here).

 

Consoles- MP and SP BF2:MC 2005.

 

MW1 is considered by most people on both platforms to have started the Modern setting. Mostly due to popularity and it penetrating the gaming/casual mindset.

 

Again, that's a very bare-bones discussion but it's a start which I need to build an article on. Thoughts?

 

I'm not sure if I can thank everyone individually in the article, but I will ask the higher-ups if I can include a link to TAY for the help at least. You guys ok with that or do I need to give you separate foot massages? Haha!

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

MW1 is considered by most people on both platforms to have started the Modern setting. Mostly due to popularity and it penetrating the gaming/casual mindset.

 

Again, that's a very bare-bones discussion but it's a start which I need to build an article on. Thoughts?

 

If you want to work in something about how people hold minsets like this (I also think of what people say about Halo in this regard) just because something was more popular than something else it could make a nice little paragraph and perhaps grab a hold of your readers who think this way assuming you don't write it condescendingly.

[Vargras]

I'd say that, if anything, BF2 definitely popularized it.

 

Were there other modern shooters before BF2? Definitely. But BF2 practically exploded in popularity, and is still played to this day.

[AgamemnonV2]

I don't see how "simple in concept" is relevant. But yeah, that was the first "modern" online FPS I can remember and it certainly is popular and influential.

Simple in concept as it was a simple mod from Half-Life, i.e. there's not much depth to the game (it's Half-Life multilayer with a pretty face lift). Its popularity, however, comes from its famous 1.6 version, which I'd bet on being the most pirated game internationally (and also why it's still played extensively internationally).

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

I don't see how "simple in concept" is relevant. But yeah, that was the first "modern" online FPS I can remember and it certainly is popular and influential.

Simple in concept as it was a simple mod from Half-Life, i.e. there's not much depth to the game (it's Half-Life multilayer with a pretty face lift). Its popularity, however, comes from its famous 1.6 version, which I'd bet on being the most pirated game internationally (and also why it's still played extensively internationally).

 

I get that it's a simple concept. I don't see how it being a simple concept is relevant. You say "however" as if its simple concept is a bad thing in terms of relevance. If anything its simple concept of a modern shooter pitting terrorists vs counter terrorists is what has made it popular.

[Mercurial]

Sims 2 is the most pirated game.

Also I never got these discussions. Who care who made what first as long as shits fun it doesn't matter.

Edited April 12, 2011 by Hakidia