Faiblesse Des Sens Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 I don't expect the Xbone to be much of a success until they either drop the price significantly or do away with all these restrictions. What makes you think its core audience cares about the restrictions? I don't think we're able to accurately judge mainstream reaction just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 I agree that most people probably won't know or care about the restrictions (at least near launch, depending on how that goes it might get bad word of mouth), but I think the $100 price difference will help Sony immensely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Jack Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 My point is that informed gamers won't buy it because of the drm and the casual audience won't buy it in droves because of the price, especially when the ps4 is a lot cheaper and, as far as grandma knows, does the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faiblesse Des Sens Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 An informed gamer might care more about exclusives and the series they like more than DRM at the end of the day. You assume everyone not only shares the same opinion but that they will act in according to that opinion. Insert classic image of the "Boycott MW2" steam group where half the people were playing MW2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. GOH! Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 MJ: the casual audience includes many folks for whom $500 is not an unreasonable amount to spend on a console they'll use only occasionally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 An informed gamer might care more about exclusives and the series they like more than DRM at the end of the day. Perfect example: me and Halo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Jack Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 http://gimmegimmegames.com/2013/06/gamestop-handing-out-flyers-to-tell-customers-about-xbox-ones-restrictions/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoStarr Posted June 14, 2013 Report Share Posted June 14, 2013 This pretty much proves to my personally that the Xbone is the next Dreamcast. Sega died a hero; Microsoft has lived long enough to see itself become the villain. MJ: the casual audience includes many folks for whom $500 is not an unreasonable amount to spend on a console they'll use only occasionally. Is that really gonna be enough to drive sales to a profitable margin though? I think people are really underestimating the power of word of mouth. Just because a person doesn't play a whole lot of video games, chances are they probably know at least one person who knows the scene that they'll talk about it with. I honestly think about 95% of my friends have consulted me before buying a console. If somebody tells me they're buying an X-Box next gen, damn sure I'll be droppin some knowledge on them. Also; I'm surprised nobody has brought up the Amazon poll yet; http://www.ibtimes.com/ps4-gamers-strongly-prefer-ps4-xbox-one-according-amazon-poll-photo-1307919 Basically Amazon put a poll up on Facebook asking people what console they would get. 30k for PS4; 1.6k for X-Box. Being an online poll though; it doesn't mean much. Reddit or 4chan might have had some influence on it (I have no idea). 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecha Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 This pretty much proves to my personally that the Xbone is the next Dreamcast. Sega died a hero; Microsoft has lived long enough to see itself become the villain. lol Love that. Don't think they ever were the great District Attorney though. Maybe they became Two Face around Windows 95...or before. Anyway. Yes...my analogy sucked donkey balls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 This pretty much proves to my personally that the Xbone is the next Dreamcast. Sega died a hero; Microsoft has lived long enough to see itself become the villain. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Heat Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 Two things that came up in my news feed today. http://www.neowin.net/news/anonymous-xbox-engineer-explains-drm-and-microsofts-xbox-one-intentions and 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Jack Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 Simpleminded? Well fuck you too, guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. GOH! Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 (edited) MJ: the casual audience includes many folks for whom $500 is not an unreasonable amount to spend on a console they'll use only occasionally. Is that really gonna be enough to drive sales to a profitable margin though? I think people are really underestimating the power of word of mouth. Just because a person doesn't play a whole lot of video games, chances are they probably know at least one person who knows the scene that they'll talk about it with. I honestly think about 95% of my friends have consulted me before buying a console. If somebody tells me they're buying an X-Box next gen, damn sure I'll be droppin some knowledge on them. Yes, over time. A shitload of teenagers with well-off parents will want and get it because they don't give a rat's ass about the price. Folks enamored with the kinect will happily buy it. Folks who can be swayed by Best Buy salesfolks will buy the Xbone. People who have to justify the cost to their families, significant others, whatever will buy it because they can argue it has extra functionality everyone can enjoy. There are lots of non-vocal target demographics out there who will drive the Xbone's sales. The target Xbone demo isn't going to be single dude gamers in their 20's; the word of mouth among that demo will remain bad. But it's not a huge demo, and mainstream acceptance will work in the Xbone's favor. ETA: that pastebin article makes tons of sense. I would not be at all surprised if MS wanted to emulate Steam's success. But I would be surprised if it offers deeply discounted sales with the regularity and breadth of Steam's. Edited June 15, 2013 by Mr. GOH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Heat Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 I thought it made sense too, but to see Microsoft try to do it when they don't have the same kind of reputation as Valve? I personally think the spiel about games being cheaper is just someone trying to feed me a line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Jack Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 Not a chance in hell they'll make games cheaper. You can buy games from lots of digital marketplaces on the pc. The Xbox One is going to have one marketplace. There's no competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post WTF Posted June 15, 2013 Popular Post Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 I think people are confusing failure with ROI, profitability and expectation. The XBone need not fail per se but unless they turn around it will sell dramatically less. First rule of new console generation : The rules are reset. What you did in the past has no relevance in the future. Especially so if you console has no backwards compatibility. Second rule: Price matters. If it didn't Samsung wouldn't have taken over Sony and Panasonic in the consumer electronics department. (Even if it's an out of context example). OK getting back to consoles - The PS3 came after 2 generations of incredible success. The PS1 sold about 110-120M. The PS2 at the launch of the PS3 was sitting at 120-130M approx. The PS3 at the launch of the PS4 will be about 82-85M. That's a decline of 40-50M after two successive successful generations with a global mindshare. The 360 is launching at the period when they probably will have 82-84M globally. It will decline. MS expects it to hit that target. Consistent backlash in the media will cause a loss of sales. You don't think negative media coverage is going to affect sales? I mean right now you have the US Military involved saying what the hell? The US is their single most strategic market. If not for that market loyalty their global sales would be about 40-50M. Now they're pretty much sabotaging themselves. Unless they turn things around you can expect a return to the original Xbox sales of 30-40M lifetime. It's okay but it's nothing to write home about. This is not what MS expect, this isn't what they're bankrolling. It could be lesser still if peope decide to just buy tablets instead. The console market has increased in size but going against public opinion isn't smart. I think people forget how fast word spreads today. When the last gen launched we never had twitter revolutions or anything. Negative news spreads faster. People remember negative shit faster. Something positive. No. Not that much. The market has changed. If people expect this not to have an impact on sales, they're wrong. It's not about selling. It's about selling to expectations. You don't build a product and think okay if I sell without making a loss it's good enough. If that were the case we'd still have Zune. We'd have creative MP3 players, we'd have the Panasonic Kuro. They want to sell on par or greater than the 360. That's what won't happen. They have internal projections that make them believe they can acheive a greater marketshare in the US than they currently possess. I think people forget the importance of brand value. For instance, FF was a ridiculously strong brand in the 90s. Even if Versus sorry 15 is a good game, it's unlikely it'll hit the sales figures of 7 or 8. And this game definitely would have cost more. However they would have adjusted for that I hope (though their targets for TombRaider, Hitman and such make me think they'd be stupid -.-). Last generation, the Wii was the market leader and people really bought into it. I mean it's the console that sold about 100M. What's the WiiU's adoption rate? Crap. Mostly cause there's not enough games. 3.5 M global in half a year when they expected >5.5M isn't good. Early adopters dropped. It's a blank slate. Marketing and such only can make a certain amount of difference. This is like saying an uncharismatic leader of the party in power that has been saying all the wrong things will still win 45% of the votes when their rivals have a better sounding labour and basically just need to say 'I'm not doing what they're doing'. Opinions change, popularity changes. Tides change. I'm not saying the Xbone will not be profitable, but the company can count it as a flop unless they change the tide of public opinion. I mean you've got MSNBC saying MS doesn't care for the troops and Maddow retweeting something. It's just a piece of consumer electronic, it shouldn't matter but it's now got strong negative brand association. Unless they go about changing that it's only going to get worse. So like I'm saying. They need to shut up for a while, regroup and think of a new strategy to sell or they can pretty much ride the wave of notoriety. Looking at Win8, Surface etc - it's clear that they don't care about the consumer business because B2B is where they make most of their earnings (Server side, tools and corporate stuff). Or maybe it's the MS cycle of good product, shit product, good product, shit product. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deanb Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 As far as negative:positive stuff spreading and being remembered. I read recently there's some psychiatric thinking along lines of it taking 3 positive things to outweigh a negative experience. (Hmm, it was on a google design blog now I think of it, it was a thing they referenced, either way it's a thing that is probably rather true). Anywho I expected this and here it is: "New Xbox 'a sin against all service members'" http://www.armytimes.com/article/20130614/OFFDUTY02/306140030/New-Xbox-sin-against-all-service-members- And I imagine within the US this is a pretty big deal that'll likely sway not just service members, but their family, friends and general population. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Jack Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 I have my doubts that they'll change their policies unless things get really drastic. I mean they are STILL charging indie devs for patches and insisting that they can't self publish. Still! For a company that insists they're future proof, that is really backwards thinking. Even though at this point that policy does them more harm than good, they refuse to change it. I expect the same attitude with the restrictions. If you find something wrong with it, well, that's your problem. Not only that but they still require a subscription to use media apps like Netflix. As far as I know they are the only hardware manufacturer that does this. They're just set in their ways and because of that they're ironically going to be the ones who end up stuck in the past, rather than leading the way to the future. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 I think the deep discounts are the only reason why Steam works so well, so unless MS can emulate that part of the business model it's not going to fly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecha Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 I think the deep discounts are the only reason why Steam works so well, so unless MS can emulate that part of the business model it's not going to fly. The competition also makes those cuts work...Steam deals with a bit more competition than MS' XB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waldorf and Statler Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 Yeah Steam does as many sells as it does because it can afford it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecha Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 (edited) What...is he wearing? Edited June 15, 2013 by Vecha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercurial Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Heart Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Xbox-One-Games-E3-Were-Running-Windows-7-With-Nvidia-GTX-Cards-56737.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Heart Posted June 15, 2013 Report Share Posted June 15, 2013 And also this: http://boingboing.net/2013/06/15/xbox-one-will-divide-eu-into-d.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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