deanb Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=NkjbJOSwq3A "OBAMA WANTS EVERYONE TO GO COLLEGE.......what a snob"....ok I saw this late but could someone explain this to me? Incredible. Surely Obama wants everyone to have the opportunity or the choice to go to college? He's not gonna run around stuffing rednecks into hessian sacks and dumping them in college campuses (campi?) to have liberals force book-learnin' on them. Actually what Obama said (not going to be bothered to find the video) was that he wants every American to commit to at least one year of higher education, whether that's a four year university, a community college, trade school or an apprenticeship (he actually mentioned all of those things). See that sounds much more likely. And fairly sensible. I guess it's harder to bitch about those liberal hippy plumbers. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thursday Next Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 Ok, like Dean says. Much more sensible. Also, love that cracked article. I'm pretty sure I've said some of those things... or at least alluded to them myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope V2 Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) This is the kind of story that makes my head asplode: http://www.foxnews.c...s-voter-id-law/ The fact that anyone can argue that photo id is discriminatory when they are readily available to any legitimate citizen is just crazy. Maybe if there was some high cost or if it were even a little hard to get an ID they'd have a point but getting an ID is no harder than getting out and voting or even registering to vote. This is such a stupid and obviously political decision. Shame on this Tom Perez. also: I guess every single person who's ever had to get a drivers license has had to endure "undue hardship" and that might be true considering the lines at the dmv..... Edited March 12, 2012 by Yantelope V2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 The fact that anyone can argue that photo id is discriminatory when they are readily available to any legitimate citizen is just crazy. Disclaimer: didn't read the link, just responding to this one bit. I tend to agree with you, but the key is "when they are readily available". I have read of several states where they pass a law requiring photo ID for voting, and then make it their policy not to tell people that it's possible to get an ID for free. THAT is discriminatory. That said, I'm perfectly fine with requiring a state-issued photo ID if you actually do make it readily available and advertise that you can get an ID for free. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battra92 Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 The fact that anyone can argue that photo id is discriminatory when they are readily available to any legitimate citizen is just crazy. Disclaimer: didn't read the link, just responding to this one bit. I tend to agree with you, but the key is "when they are readily available". I have read of several states where they pass a law requiring photo ID for voting, and then make it their policy not to tell people that it's possible to get an ID for free. THAT is discriminatory. That said, I'm perfectly fine with requiring a state-issued photo ID if you actually do make it readily available and advertise that you can get an ID for free. I find it rather insulting when the arguments come back that Voter ID is racist or its discriminatory against the poor. Funny, I figured that it was discriminatory against non-citizens. :-/ I also agree with Yant that the Justice Department is motivated by politics more than actual justice (see the Justice Dept vs Arizona Immigration laws.) I do agree with you about educating the public about the free State ID cards and that should, of course, be included in any notice about the law passage.Which states were deliberately withholding information about free ID cards? I haven't heard of that happening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 Wisconsin was the only one I found on a quick search. I had been under the impression there were others but I could be wrong. http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/news/129469023.html http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/129400013.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mary-bottari/wisconsin-voter-id-_b_954976.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFlyingGerbil Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 it says in the article you'd have to pay for the voter id. I can't believe they could get away with placing a financial barrier between voter and their right to vote. It doesn't mention a state id though. Are they free to obtain? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 it says in the article you'd have to pay for the voter id. I can't believe they could get away with placing a financial barrier between voter and their right to vote. It doesn't mention a state id though. Are they free to obtain? I missed that part, I assumed there was a free alternative in Texas like in all the other states that passed an ID requirement. Yeah, that could definitely be an unconstitutional poll tax on top of the discrimination claims (states can't charge people to vote). All the IDs they accept are "state" IDs though. Stuff like driver's license, military ID, concealed-carry license, passport, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFlyingGerbil Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) it says in the article you'd have to pay for the voter id. I can't believe they could get away with placing a financial barrier between voter and their right to vote. It doesn't mention a state id though. Are they free to obtain? I missed that part, I assumed there was a free alternative in Texas like in all the other states that passed an ID requirement. Yeah, that could definitely be an unconstitutional poll tax on top of the discrimination claims (states can't charge people to vote). All the IDs they accept are "state" IDs though. Stuff like driver's license, military ID, concealed-carry license, passport, etc. sorry, not sure how it works in the US, by State ID card I meant a generic identity card which is just to identify who you are and that you're a resident of that state and not for a specific thing like gun ownership/driving. Seems like you'd have to pay for all the other ones you mentioned which is why I thought there may be a generic identity card that you could apply for for free. I know they wanted to introduce one to the UK a few years ago and there was an absolute stink over it, lots of civil liberty groups up in arms, and other people about the expense of it running into the billions. Only got canned after we wasted a fortune. Edited March 12, 2012 by TheFlyingGerbil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 Yeah, most states already have some kind of generic ID card, but normally it's not free and it's optional (it's basically a driver's license without the "license to drive" part). AFAI knew all the states that had passed voter ID laws had made that generic ID free to avoid the "poll tax" issue, so I assumed Texas had done the same. Apparently not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFlyingGerbil Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 Thanks for clearing all that up, TME. (With my demonstrably limited knowledge) it seems to make sense that the Government would block that then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. GOH! Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Voter ID laws: a solution in search of a problem. I love that the libertarians up in here are all about state-issued IDs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thursday Next Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Brilliance. Sheer brilliance. Santorum is obviously using some Derren Brown / Jedi mind trick / reverse psychology tactics to get everyone to vote for him by telling them that they need to vote for someone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope V2 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Well, this should come as a shock to absolutely nobody. http://campaign2012....r-10-yrs/425831 I like to show this whenever people mention a trillion dollars. http://www.pagetutor.com/trillion/index.html Edited March 14, 2012 by Yantelope V2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faiblesse Des Sens Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Over 10 years that's not much. Plus, you know, every other fucking industrialized nation does this. I haven't had health insurance for 6 years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope V2 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 The point is that Obama sold the whole project as being "defeceit neutral" and was telling everyone that it wouldn't add anything to the debt. That was why he had to tout the "around $900 billion" figure. Clearly this was misleading. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faiblesse Des Sens Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 People view politics so backwards. $900 billion was an estimate. It's hard to predict how much this sort of thing will cost especially with the bureaucratic nightmare that is the US government. Either way, I think cost is irrelevant. Everyone should be able to get cheap/free basic medical care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope V2 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Except that this wasn't hard to predict. Everyone knew he was fudging the $900 billion factor using a number of tricks so that's why I said the 2 Trillion total cost was no surprise. It's been no surprise that this thing was going to add another Trillion dollars to the national debt but Obama and the democratic congress should be held accountable for being completely dishonest about the costs of the legislation. Edit: http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/09/09/obama-health-care-reform-will-not-increase-deficit/ All the conservative commentators then were saying that the $900 billion figure was a joke. Edited March 14, 2012 by Yantelope V2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faiblesse Des Sens Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Well, politics are a joke in general. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Everyone always lies about what their proposals will do, and especially what they will cost/save, on both sides. I do understand where you're coming from though, and I'd probably be doing the same thing if it was a program I opposed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope V2 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Well, not everyone lies about everything although politicians lying is not news. I will say that I find that everytime I talk about Obama and all the lousy things he does to people who voted for him they respond with "everyone does that" as if it somehow absolves Obama. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faiblesse Des Sens Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Don't hate the player, hate the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 I will say that I find that everytime I talk about Obama and all the lousy things he does to people who voted for him they respond with "everyone does that" as if it somehow absolves Obama. Yeah, I didn't so much mean it as a defense of him, more as an explanation as to why I can't bring myself to care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope V2 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 So what does it take for people to care? Does he personally have to punch a hadicapped person while urinating on the American flag? It just seems like nothing he does bothers his supporters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMightyEthan Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Can't speak for others, but I certainly care about the NDAA. I won't be voting for president this term because of it (cannot in good conscience support any of the candidates). But a politician lying about something is one of those things that's so expected that I just can't care when another specific example comes to light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.