Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance

[SixTwoSixFour]

Well, I don't think many of us saw that coming.

 

Previously pitched as a predator stealth game, Metal Gear Solid: Rising is now Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance, a rabidly fast hack n slash action game. From what I've seen it looks like Vanquish meets No More Heroes, which is on the one hand music to my ears- I love both games with a passion- but also kind of distressing, as it doesn't really feel like Metal Gear anymore.

 

It's... I mean, I don't know what to think. What about you gents?

[Cyber Rat]

Aside from how awful the word Revengeance sounds, it's made by Platinum games and it's an over-the-top sword-fighting hack and slash game. What's there not to like?

 

I mean, it's only set in the same universe as Metal Gear. It's like complaining Dissidia is distressing in regards to the future of Final Fantasy games.

Edited December 11, 2011 by Cyber Rat

[toxicitizen]

I mean, it's only set in the same universe as Metal Gear. It's like complaining Dissidia is distressing in regards to the future of Final Fantasy games.

That's really not a valid comparison. Final Fantasy is a series made up of completely unrelated games all taking place in different kinds of worlds. You can really do whatever the hell you want, slap the FF name on it and it doesn't mean anything.

 

The Metal Gear series, on the other hand, has mostly been adhering to one world and one timeline. Sure, there's occasional side game like Ghost Babel or the Acid titles that doesn't really fit into the canon, but Rising is obviously more high profile than those ever were.

 

Like SixTwo said, there's no doubt that Platinum makes amazing action games and I'm sure this will be no different. Their style just doesn't seem like a good fit for the tone of the Metal Gear series.

Edited December 11, 2011 by FLD

[Cyber Rat]

Ghah, was too lazy to look at a proper example. Ok, here's a better one: Shining Franchise, various Yakuza spin-offs... Really, it's not even Metal Gear Solid anymore, it's Metal Gear Rising. I don't know how obvious a hint you need that the universe is the only thing it shares with the MGS games.

Edited December 11, 2011 by Cyber Rat

[Strangelove]

If it makes anyone here feel better, the game takes place after MGS4, but it's not really canon.

MGS Rising was canon, but it was scrapped. This new Platinum one is not. Enjoy it.

Edited December 11, 2011 by Strangelove

[Cyber Rat]

There you go. I see no reason to have an issue with it then. Just enjoy slicing giant robots like a boss.

Edited December 11, 2011 by Cyber Rat

[Strangelove]

Seriously though, if youre going to make a game based on Cyborg Raiden, this was the way to do it. If I have a sword and can move at tremendous speeds, I dont want to be stealthy, I wanna use that sword and cut some shit up and have lightning come out of the sky and strike my foes and have both my arms ripped off and fuck Rosemary with her big ol titties and then bleed white jizz-looking blood all over the place in my goddamn high heels. Thats what its all about, man. Thats why were all here.

[toxicitizen]

Where have you heard it's not canon? It would seem like a weird thing to say this early on. "We're making this new Metal Gear game, but it's totally irrelevant to the story you all like!" lol

 

But anyway, just to be clear, I'm not taking issues with the game or angry about it or anything. I just feel like it's an extremely weird direction to take for the series. Not really sold on it, but I'm open to the game still being fun.

 

And the original concept for Rising never really gave me the impression it was going to be about stealth all that much. I don't think the game genre ever really changed. It's mostly the switch in tone that bugs me. MGSR seemed like it was going to be playing it straight like most of the Metal Gear games do.

[Strangelove]

Well, its kind of sort of maybe not canon. From what ive heard, its taking place in the same universe, so technically it is canon, but nothing dealing with the Solid series will be discussed or be a part of Rising. I guess kind of like Half Life and Portal being in the same universe, but never meeting in any way.

 

I just hope to God no one is going to be playing this for the story. Kojima has pretty much no input and Platinum couldnt write a decent story or dialogue to save their lives.

[Strangelove]

Heres the link to the story stuff:

 

http://andriasang.com/comzba/mg_rising_details/

[SixTwoSixFour]

I listened to the Kojima Productions podcast on Revengeance, and I must say, I'm more optimistic now. It looks like Kojima Productions is totally in charge of writing and plot and all story things, while Platinum is totally in charge of combat. And going back to watch some old MGS4 cutscenes... I suppose this isn't really a retcon, is it? I mean, I saw that combat, and I was like "come on", but it's not all that much more powerful than he was in 4.

if you've forgotten what it was like.

 

I also think it's interesting that they're doing more exploring of Jack's probably pretty fucked up head. I mean, setting aside the psychological trauma of having your body swapped out... more than once... he's got his old child soldier personality in there. They didn't do a hell of a lot with that other than mention it in 2 and 4.

[toxicitizen]

Yeah, okay. That makes sense, I guess.

 

Also, I was writing something about how the story is an important aspect of MGS, but then SixTwo chimed in with how KojiPro is handling writing and story. So yeah, that's cool.

 

I'm still worried about the tone, but really, it's way too early to say for sure.

 

I guess the only thing that still really bothers me is that it's set after MGS4. And it's been almost 4 years, so this is all the spoiler warning I'm going to give.

 

The ending of MGS4 really implied that Raiden was done with all the fighting and going to live a happy, quiet life with Rose and his son. So they better have a damn good reason for why he'd get re-cyborg'd.

I mean, I'm sure they'll come up with a plausible excuse, but it just seems like it's undoing how nicely MGS4 wrapped up his story.

[Strangelove]

Yeah, it sucks that they scrapped the mid-quel story for this post mgs4 story.

[excel_excel]

The only thing I don't like is that the combat with the Ray looked too Bayonetta style. Also 'Jack the Ripper is back'? Didn't he spend all of MGS2 trying to get away from his horrible childhood, but now he loves what he was back then?

[toxicitizen]

Yeah, kinda feels like they'll do something utterly retarded. Like Rose and the kid getting killed and Raiden going psycho over it.

 

Which could actually make for a pretty crazy and silly fun game. Just very weird for Metal Gear.

[SixTwoSixFour]

Yeah, kinda feels like they'll do something utterly retarded. Like Rose and the kid getting killed and Raiden going psycho over it.

They did get him into a good place at the end of 4, so something must have changed. It IS called "Revengeance", so he must have something to avenge. I do hope it's something more original than the Max Payne gambit, though.

 

The only thing I don't like is that the combat with the Ray looked too Bayonetta style. Also 'Jack the Ripper is back'? Didn't he spend all of MGS2 trying to get away from his horrible childhood, but now he loves what he was back then?

 

The part with the RAY did seem a little too far to me as well. They said they're listening to feedback very carefully, so maybe they'll decide that's a step too far? And it's not, I think, a matter of him loving what he was, it's just part of him- when pushed hard enough, he reverts into that Ripper personality.

[Mister Jack]

What is the inevitable re-release of this game going to be called? Revengeancenence? Re-Revengeance?

[Strangelove]

This song needs to be played at the same time during the trailer for full effect.

[toxicitizen]

Hahahaha, I LOVE that song. That episode was pure genius.

[「Advent Chaos」]

I'm gonna go ahead and say that it was a shock feeling that me and FLD felt when we saw the trailer, it IS a big departure from what we're used to so the initial reaction may have been bad (it was in my case...). Still though,, after reading up on Kojima's tweets and everything, I'm kind of glad Rising is finally happening. Kojima always seems so stressed out about leaving the franchise to a new generation, he seemed unhappy and unsure if it was even possible to pass on his essence on to other teams. He seems very confident with Platinum Games and even if he's not producing the the story so long as he's happy with the way his franchise is being handled then I think fans should also understand. Everyone pretty much already spoke my thoughts about RAY and the whole "Jack the Ripper" thing.

 

If this does take place after MGS4 I do wonder why there is still active PMCs wanting to create ridiculous perfect cyborg soldiers, I was sure that the war economy would be at least dying out right after S.O.P. was taken down. Unless it's still being used, but controlled individually by nations rather than a series of A.I.s. I hope nothing happened to Rose and her kid, I think Raiden has been lied too enough, give him a break sheesh. If anything the whole REVENGEANCE thing could be him going after Dr.Madnar, a character who we know so little about, only that he provided dialysis for Raiden in MGS4, he seemingly also created Raiden's "White-blooded Scout" cyborg body. I could be wrong, but Raiden's cyborg changes were against his will and going back to the whole PMC business, Dr.Madnar could be re-fueling the war economy by cyborg-rizing PMCs and Raiden's going out to stop him.

[FMW]

This looks cool! Metal Gear has a couple of problems. One, Kojima has been looking for excuses to stop making them for years now. Two, the continuity is almost entirely wrapped up so it's pretty tough to justify another sequel.

 

So here we go. Drop Metal Gear "Solid", make a new subtitle. Make the game it's own spin-off franchise kinda like Acid. Give it to another developer. Set it further ahead in continuity than anything else, so it can invent it's own new conflicts and villains etc. Now you've fixed the continuity problem and you're moving the franchise in a direction where perhaps Kojima could go hands off in the future.

 

For all that this solves old problems though, there are some potential new ones. Snake always played sort of a straight man to his completely crazy over the top universe. Sure, a guy is vomiting bees at you, but Snake only has the tools of a normal soldier. That's a strength this game looks to abandon, what with Raiden throwing mechs around and everything.

 

Say, what with Metal Gear becoming an action game and Splinter Cell going MIA after Conviction, are there ANY high profile stealth franchises left? All I can think of that fits the bill at all is Sly 4.

[toxicitizen]

While not formally announced, it's been known for a while that Ubisoft Toronto are working on a follow-up to Conviction, presumably with the same type of faster gameplay.

 

There's also Thief 4, which I have high hopes for considering the amazing job Eidos Montreal did with Human Revolution.

[「Advent Chaos」]

Okay, I made some big mistakes. Dr. Drago Pettrovich Madnar actually just helped engineer "White blood". I had only heard of Dr.Madnar on MGS4, but it turns out he goes back to Metal Gear and helped (?) Big Boss develop the (Metal Gear) TX-55. Even after being rescued by Solid Snake in the Outer Heaven Uprising he still sided with Big Boss in Zanzibarland, bringing back the half-dead Big Boss. After Metal Gear 2 happened, apparently he just went to hiding to Eastern Europe then the whole thing with MGS4 happens.

 

Okay so my theory still barely applies, he could be engineering PMCs into cyborgs, but it's a bit of a stretch. So since Raiden's cyborg body was forced upon him by Area 51 then Raiden might be going against them.

 

And that's the last time I read the MGS4 Database instead of studying for a final. It's like getting stuck in a Wikipedia/TVtropes loop.

[SixTwoSixFour]

Well, okay. Let's think about this logically.

 

1) Raiden is back in a combat body, and back on the battlefield. He gave that up in MGS4 to be with Rosemary and Little John, so presumably, something must have changed there. Kidnapping? Death? Just necessity? Not sure what, but his home life can't be as ideal as it was looking.

 

2) The war economy was collapsing at the end of 4... but it was taking a lot of people down with it. The end of the war economy means a bunch of PMCs with no jobs, and it means a bunch of nations in debt from their huge war budgets. And it DOESN'T mean the end of conflict. Just because war doesn't run everything anymore, doesn't mean it won't still be around... and probably still a big deal.

 

Imagine, for example, what would happen to a PMC of 20,000 elite mercs at the end of the war economy. Some of those people would quit, retire, become cops or security guards or something. But a lot would just keep on mercing... and with the war economy over, they would be hungry for work. Wouldn't take much for some mercs to decide to manufacture some work, if you know what I mean. Overthrow a local government, maybe.

 

3) Okay, yeah, the more I think about it, the more that fight with the RAY just seems ridiculous.

[「Advent Chaos」]

The debt nations have should be immense though, to keep fueling the economy that has set a death sentence on them would be foolis- oop nevermind. Okay so, say that there a few strong and leading PMCs out there creating more work for themselves why is Raiden trying to stop them? Sure, the war economy may still thrive, but it won't be the leading one, the world economy will keep rebuilding until it's somewhat stable. Or so I would like to think. Could it be because of the technological threat of cyborg soldiers present? Wouldn't that be going against regular evolution?

then again he'd be fighting against the times just like Big Boss once did...

 

Yes yes, that RAY fight seems pretty ridiculous. Maybe as one of the later boss battles, y'know like the most advanced and powerful RAY design up to that timeline. If this is not the case, knowing Platinum Games, Raiden will be fighting some colossal Metal Gears, bigger than Coccoon or Arsenal (Arsenal is considered a Metal Gear, right?).

 

Also I gotta say, I'm kind of surprised that Platinum Games had some footage to show. As an opportunity to work on the Metal Gear franchise, it'd be crazy to pass up on and yeah it's very likely that they used a lot of assets from what the old team had (although to me the footage shown seems like all original work from them). My surprise is that I thought they were so intently focused on Anarchy Reigns, which made the footage shown feel like I was watching Anarchy Reigns, just with Raiden.

 

 

Speaking Anarchy Reigns, I am sooo looking forward to it~