Assassin's Creed 3

[Thursday Next]

It's the marketing I find offensive. I don't recall any marketing for previous games pointing out what villainous freedom hating scum the Crusaders, Roman Catholic Church or Byzantines were. Yet all the marketing for AC3 so far seems to be anti-British. If the game ends up as balanced in it's execution as the rest, fine, but if it's going to be 5 hours of a game telling me a totally one sided story about how awesome America is and how crap the British are, then I'm not down for that.

[CorgiShinobi]

"Equally distributed" would imply the British Army and Revolutionary Army were equal in both men and military strength.

 

Except they weren't.

 

If you were to market a rebellious assassin, master of his domain, merciless, yet respectful, it has a greater effect that Connor would stare down an army of a world power such as the British Empire. When we play as Connor, it would all make sense why we will kill/target who we must. A commercial however can not go into the detail of a game series that expands the perimeters of a typical trilogy. A series that is soaked to the bone in conspiracy, secrecy, and so much lore that there is an encyclopedia detailing an expanded universe made up of games, books, comics, and random tidbits.

 

Maybe there could be commercials where Connor is just an observer of all the war acts going on between the two forces, but states his enemies have a greater influence or something. Sadly I'm not part of the marketing for this game and have no say in the matter.

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

It's the marketing I find offensive. I don't recall any marketing for previous games pointing out what villainous freedom hating scum the Crusaders, Roman Catholic Church or Byzantines were. Yet all the marketing for AC3 so far seems to be anti-British. If the game ends up as balanced in it's execution as the rest, fine, but if it's going to be 5 hours of a game telling me a totally one sided story about how awesome America is and how crap the British are, then I'm not down for that.

 

I'm sorry, but can you post examples of the marketing they are using that seems to be anti-British rather than just having Redcoats as enemies?

[Thursday Next]

The video... The live action one that Maritan posted a whole page ago. The one that lists "having to learn British History" as a decent reason for an uprising. It's pretty much a minute and a half of anti-Britishness.

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

I haven't seen any of the live action videos. The actual trailers for the game don't reek of anti-Britishness. I think what I've seen so far is very PC.

[Hot Heart]

Problem I have is, like ACII, they are clearly going for some sort of arc for the protagonist (which is a good thing!) but if marketing is to be believed, they've gone for the most trite idea ever.

[CorgiShinobi]

About "learning British history" which is as follows, "When I refuse to learn the history of a country I'll never see."

 

If this were a 21st century classroom, sure I'd be right with you about it being pretty darn xenophobic.

 

Except it's a classroom set in the mid-18th century. A time where the only way that child could ever see Britain is if he became a soldier for the Empire or worked his way into a high political office and his intent was seen worthy of him being shipped oversea. It's about identity, and the events leading to the Revolutionary War being a pure personification of The Ant and the Grasshopper fable.

 

I could go on, but lets look at a more modern example.

 

Isn't it disturbing how Chinese children learn American history and English as their mandatory second language? Sure, if they achieve a career in international relations where those skills become beneficial, all the better. At the least, when the children have become adults they'll be better equipped to assemble American products. Now this could be seen as an economical issue, but the cultural implications that your success is based on a foreign world power are off-putting.

 

Oh hey, look at me being all Anti-America here.

[deanb]

So the only reason you'd learn another countries history is to assemble products for that market? Damn, here's me all trained n equipped to be making roman exports. Also don't forget american history is and was british history. People didn't suddenly end up in America, they didn't pull their laws from their arse or coincidently come up with names like "New York", "Washington" etc. I'm most likely never going to visit Rome but you still learn the history (especially since Roman history is British history too).

 

It'd be nice if it at least attempted to have some mention of the templar versus assassin war playing in it instead of just focusing on the overt revolutionary war. In all the other games the wars, the crusade, etc were just the backdrop to the Assassin hero tracking down the Templars. It's part of why I always disliked the suggestion of setting it in times like WWII, the allure of focusing too much on the history instead of on the plotline of Assassins Creed.

[CorgiShinobi]

Again, it's about identity, not education. Giving up body, but not mind, and so forth. Is it a good promotional live action spot? Eh, they could have done a lot better, but it's also out of a dozen other spots we've seen throughout the year.

 

And yes, I've taken history courses, even "World History," something that is falling from grace as of late. I know some Spanish as well, which has come in handy. Still, the colonies were like a century old British slum across the Atlantic ocean. Whatever happened as far as cultural development in the colonies what given a backseat to the affairs of Britain. You have to ask yourself, how much of the colonies would have been undermined over the developments of Britain? Sure, we could act like it was such a privilege to learn of Britain and all its glory, to accept all their laws that the local "government" had no say in...

 

Of course, as a favorite quote of mine goes, "We can't concern ourselves with what was. We must act on what is."

 

Then again, part of the appeal to Assassin's Creed is its throw at world history. As I said, the conspiracy, secrecy, etc... Personally I'm more interested in the gameplay, but parts of it peek my interest. When I said there was an expanded universe, it really is like it's own universe. There are historical figures who have been labeled Assaasin and Templar that probably won't be mentioned at all in the games.

 

Chances are this is all a waste and when we grab hold of ACIII we'll be discussing something inane about Connor or future Desmond's actions being something-something.

[Thursday Next]

If it's about identity then is America's identity wilfully (and pridefully) ignorant? It's like not learning maths because "you will never use it" or not learning biology because you aren't going to practice medicine.

 

As I said above, if AC3 like the others, uses the events of the revolution as a backdrop for the struggle between the Templars and Assassins then fine. If it's "How the Assassins and the Americans vanquished the British" then I'll be a bit disappointed. So long as the gameplay is fresh (I think AC is suffering a bit of franchise fatigue) then I'll pick it up and enjoy it, but the narrative in these games does interest me.

 

I'd be fairly impressed if they pull a twist and the founding fathers are all Templars but I doubt Ubi would be so ballsy.

[Maritan]

So long as the gameplay is fresh (I think AC is suffering a bit of franchise fatigue) then I'll pick it up and enjoy it

It's Assassin's Creed, and that means its the same "Press X to win" we've seen in previous games.

Edited July 6, 2012 by Maritan

[Thursday Next]

I know that it's not going to be a fundamental shift in the way it plays. I'm not asking for Assassin's Kart.

 

I mean from 1 -> 2 there was a lot of depth added to the game. Missions were more varied and they dropped the formulaic go to town, pickpocket eavesdrop etc. Assassinate. Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Thing. Then from 2 -> ACB they added the recruiting and the noteriety. ACR doesn't feel like it has added anything new really. I like the idea of controlling zones, maybe they could take that idea further. Do away with the tower defence stuff, but have an Assassin controlled zone behave differently. Shops are cheaper, petty crimes like pickpocketing are more common, but beatings and killings are reduced or something.

[CorgiShinobi]

If it's about identity then is America's identity wilfully (and pridefully) ignorant? It's like not learning maths because "you will never use it" or not learning biology because you aren't going to practice medicine.

 

It's like we're forgetting the era here or something, right? Comparing educational standards (if any at all) of a standalone mid-18th century schoolhouse with the standards of a 21st century educational system.

 

Flawless

 

But I digress, this isn't the point still. And yes, I guess we would have to be willfully ignorant to want to deny the moniker of a British asset to become our own independent country making its own destiny. I swear, if this small clip gets you in so worked up about "Anti-British" sentiment, I hope you never find yourself watching The Patriot with Mel Gibson.

[deanb]

I'm curious as to what history kids in18th century america would be expecting to learn. Not like there was much around if you avoided teaching global history. There's nothing at all that stops you teaching about global history and "making your destiny".

 

Also The Patriot would be the film with Jason Isaacs (fine British actor) and Jayne Cobb on the British side and the two Australians (part of the Commonwealth) actors on the US side right?

[CorgiShinobi]

I'm curious as to what history kids in18th century america would be expecting to learn. Not like there was much around if you avoided teaching global history. There's nothing at all that stops you teaching about global history and "making your destiny".

 

Also The Patriot would be the film with Jason Isaacs (fine British actor) and Jayne Cobb on the British side and the two Australians (part of the Commonwealth) actors on the US side right?

Yep, but still... IT'S ANTI-BRITISH!

 

In fact, since we have Mel Gibson as the lead role, I wonder if that makes it anti-semitic too.

 

Anyway, I'm finding it befuddling how this is the one thing we keep talking about. I mean, we could go on, and on, and even more so on. I hardly believe "British history" (if that's what it was even called) was not taught even after the war, but even I have forgotten what is probably the more important aspect to this all.

 

Propaganda.

 

Both the Patriots and Loyalists were knee deep in propaganda. People today will talk about how there's an "agenda" somewhere, but it was an undeniable truth in the Revolutionary era. Newspapers and pamphlets were more privately owned and distributed, and it stands to reason authority figures (bosses, captains, teachers) let their bias circumvent the work at hand. That's the thing, a teacher was the only source of knowledge for children. Whatever that lone individual knew was what future adults would know in their lifetime. (EDIT: It's said history is written by the victors, but one wonders how well a teacher can "read.")

 

While I'm still more interested in the gameplay, we're probably going to see these biases as Connor (an observer) throughout the locations and missions.

Edited July 6, 2012 by Atomsk88

[deanb]

Anyway, I'm finding it befuddling how this is the one thing we keep talking about.

Not really.

[CorgiShinobi]

Anyway, I'm finding it befuddling how this is the one thing we keep talking about.

Not really.

In relation to the live action spot? As far as I can tell, we really didn't go into any of the other scenes.

 

Kinda funny actually... a kid gets slapped on the wrist, but we have torture, home invasion, and a church armory. Maybe because it was so different considering we see this stuff on other game trailers? A concept rather than physical actions?

 

Anyway, who else got the steelbook case? Almost forgot I had that sitting at home collecting dust.

[deanb]

No in relation to AC3 things.

 

I think the kid bit was picked upon because it seemed so stupid. And it was something much safer to pick up on that the implication that the brits were the only one waterboarding n doing home invasions. But you'd have to ask Thursday on that one, he's the one that picked upon the kid part. I'm focusing on the overall lack of AvT shown instead just focusing on "brits were dicks, and that's all you'll be killing" in the marketing.

[CorgiShinobi]

Well yeah, that's obvious too.

 

I've already staked my claim that anything involving the Patriots is going to be more in-depth while the redcoats will be the common (gameplay) element since they are the law enforcement of the area. As much as we can hope that this game will revolutionize (no pun) the current system of the series, I can't help but think we'll still see quite a few mainstays of the prior games.

 

Sure, more outdoor terrain, but the villages might not act too differently. Might be strange since if we're suppose to be this impartial character, are we going to have an option to upgrade anything besides our own equipment? Given that Ezio was always suppose to be this pseudo-financer to the people, what would change if Connor is suppose to be outside of it all?

 

EDIT: And I'm willing to forgo the prior discussion as I couldn't care anymore at this point. I've been know to beat a few dead horses, even kill a few jokes in my time. Good jokes too, good indeed.

Edited July 6, 2012 by Atomsk88

[Waldorf and Statler]

I've discussed more than enough with Europeans to the point I can't give anymore of a fuck of them being displeased over it. They'll still play it.

[Maritan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiDiYJt4A0c&feature=player_detailpage

I don't understand why people wait for this peace of overhyped casual shit.

[TheMightyEthan]

I don't understand why people feel the need to go out of their way to denigrate things other people like.

 

Anyway, looks cool, though even I'm starting to get a little disappointed that they'll only show Redcoats as enemies.

[Maritan]

I don't understand why people feel the need to go out of their way to denigrate things other people like.

 

Anyway, looks cool, though even I'm starting to get a little disappointed that they'll only show Redcoats as enemies.

Sorry, I forgot that people *must* agree with the majority on this forum. This is certainly an innovative and grand product by talented french developers who know how to craft an authentic and chellenging game for the masses. Everyone who says otherwise is wrong and must be hanged on a tree.

Whoop-dee-fucking-doo.

Edited July 13, 2012 by Maritan

[Thursday Next]

You can disagree without being combative.

 

Edit: Also, I love the look of the gameplay changes. I'm still not entirely on board with just killing Red Coats all the time, would like them to show come Patriot controlled areas for balance, it can't all be under British rule can it? Overall, I do like the look of this game.

Edited July 13, 2012 by Thursday Next

[TheMightyEthan]

You can disagree without being combative.

 

This. If you don't like the game, fine, whatever, I don't care, but there's no reason to come in here just to say that (I know you posted the video, which I appreciate, but I suspect your true motive of coming in here to post it was to say the game is stupid and we're stupid for being taken in by it). I don't like fighting games but I don't go into the fighting games thread to tell them how bad fighting games are, because that would make me a dick.