The Legend of Zelda Thread

[Pojodin]

Really what I wish is that there could be a summersault to move and accelerate like in Minish Cap.  The lack of that quick reposition is driving me nuts.  It's a really bad game for running away.  ...and it's a game where more than in any Zelda in recent memory I find myself wanting to run away.  Often.

 

That was something I kept trying to do throughout the game. I was so used to rolling around in other games and it was something I did miss. On an unrelated note, it was easier to cancel out of the pegasus boots than in other games.

Edited December 2, 2013 by Pojodin

[FMW]

I haven't found those.  I figure to get them I probably need to beat that 75 second footrace, but I've tried three or four times and always come up about 5 seconds short.  Tried cheating with fast travel once, but the game caught that and said that cheating isn't allowed

[Pojodin]

Oh no, not at all. The race is for rupees and then a piece of heart. You need to do the quest in town with the thief. It's the same quest you do for the flippers.

I think you first encounter him in Kakariko village when you go to buy the empty bottle. You then head north-east out of town, past the sanctuary, across the bridge, past the witches house, merge with the far wall and cross to the north, and loop your way to the north where there is a cave in the shallow water. The thief will run into you and make a comment before running away. When you enter the cave, you find out that the guy stole the smooth gem. After you agree to retrieve the gem, return to Kakariko village and sneak up on him. He's standing in front of a wall in the northeast section of the village. He’ll run away if he sees you. To catch him, just merge with the wall and move behind him before emerging and catching him. He'll give you the pegasus boots. Then, talk to the guy who sells the empty bottle and hearts to see about buying the smooth gem. Return it to the zoras to get the flippers.

 

[TheFlyingGerbil]

Thanks for the answer, Pojodin - I didn't read the bits in spoilers, but rest rest set my mind at ease.

 

 

"I then got jumped by an assault squad of ducks"

 

LOL, if reading that quote doesn't make you want to play a game, you're on the wrong forum.

[FMW]

Okay, I've now finished the game, picked up the 100 squid babies, and collected all the augments.  Maybe not Pojodin thorough, but thorough.

 

Hits:

 

It looks really good.  No it doesn't look good in trailers.  Or screenshots.  But it looks really good when you're playing it.  And better in 3D.  Whenever the screen would freeze for a second because I'd killed a boss or something I'd be struck "Hey, this frozen frame of play actually looks really sharp!"  And the internet says the framerate is good for the people who care about that sort of thing.

 

It's something different.  This Zelda is one part Link to the Past, and one part entirely new ideas.  Almost zero parts contemporary Zelda design.  For those who want Zelda to be different, this is.

 

Dungeon Design.  Is there even a point in putting this down for a Zelda game anymore?  There hasn't been sub-par dungeon design in one of these since Phantom Hourglass, and before that not since Link's Awakening.  The dungeons are shorter than normal, but they're compressed little bites of goodness.  They all take some idea and run with it to be unique.  Spirit Tracks was all about the partner play?  That's just one dungeon here, introduced and thrown away in the space of an hour.  Same for shadow illusions.  Same for stealth.  Ideas in this game are introduced, explored, and forgotten in less time than it would take Skyward Sword to finish the tutorial on the concept.

 

Wall Walking.  So the LttP world map does NOT measure up to modern Zelda map design.  It has about as much personality as the gameboy color worlds, not even getting close to the vibrance and variation found on Zelda N64, Gamecube, or especially Gameboy Advance.  The LttP world is just... there are a lot of cliffs.  A LOT of cliffs.  I would be interested to see what percentage of the screen real estate on the LttP map was just layer cake cliffs.  Anyway, this game found a gimmick in wall walking that allows the designers to integrate complicated and multifaceted puzzles into the LttP map without altering it.  Make no mistake, without wall walking this game falls apart.

 

Misses:

 

Short.  People seem super enthused about all the things that have been cut from this Zelda, but all those cuts leave a WAY smaller experience behind.  I'm not just bitter about the dollars per hour value ratio, but it honestly affects how the game feels.  It's like Zelda in a backyard.  The quest feels like Link could have knocked it out in an afternoon or two.  Ganon's getting put to rest almost as soon as he got out.  The sages weren't trapped all THAT long... a couple hours tops.  This isn't a journey, it's a jog around the block.

 

Characters.  Zelda games have the BEST NPCs.  No joke.  Starting with Ocarina of Time, each installment has populated Hyrule (or wherever) with unique and memorably designed characters.  No crowds of generated random strangers here (with one weird exception in Twilight Princess), instead the worlds are filled with individuals with names and relationships with other characters and probably a side quest or two.  This game does not.  This game uses sages similar to how Ocarina of Time did, but the difference between the characterizations is night and day.  No future Zelda is gonna feature stained glass windows of THESE sages - I don't even remember all (any of) their names.  There are no creepy running postmen in this game, Beedle the shopkeeper is replaced by faceless randoms.  Zelda herself is not the partner from Spirit Tracks, the love interest from Skyward Sword, the enigmatic associate from Wind Waker, or the grown ruler from Twilight Princess.  She's reverted to her SNES characterization - and that's emblematic of every character in the game.

 

Small world.  It's okay to have a small world in a Zelda game, as long as it doesn't FEEL small.  I indicate Minish Cap.  That game is probably the next smallest Zelda world after Link to the Past, but it has a ton of discrete zones populated by different people and assigned different music.  There are still new places to discover and unlock hours into the game.  By comparison this overworld is smaller, looks and sounds the same most places, and there's zero attempt to give even an illusion of scale.

 

 

Conclusion:  I HOPE LAPSED ZELDA FANS ARE FUCKING HAPPY WITH THIS.  You got what you wanted.  Tutorials are cut.  Guidance is cut.  Pretty much anything that would distract from slicing monsters and delving through dungeons has been cut.  What's left behind is this tightly designed essence of Zelda that loses not only the bad that had come since LttP, but also the good.  I hope this ISN'T the future of Zelda.  I want Zelda to have characters, I want Zelda to try to tell a story, and I want Zelda to add to it's musical heritage instead of rolling around in remixes.  I want Zelda to take WAY longer to play through than this game.  People celebrate that so much artificial "gating" has been cut from this Zelda, but the obstacles that hold Link back and the things he has to do to overcome them are what give structure to the games and allow for any sense of pacing, difficulty scaling, or storytelling.  You cut all that and you're left with a core of a game with nothing to remember about it once the big pig monster is chopped up.

 

But Zelda is a fundamentally good franchise, and the fundamentals hold.  Even without any of those things I listed above, the game remains fun.  But only that.  Fun.

[Pojodin]

Ah, those are two really good points.

1. Characters. They are there, and each of the sages is a character that you meet in the game, but your interactions with each character is so brief and limited (an event or two) that you never really establish the relationships that help you to get to know the characters. This aspect has been a strength for the series in previous titles, but, as Frosted Mini-Wheats has stated, it is lacking in this game due to insufficient interaction with each/any of the characters.

2. Wall Walking. It is the new mechanic they added that carried the game. It fit quite nicely with the Link to the Past world and did add substance to the dungeons. As Frosted Mini-Wheats said, "without wall walking this game falls apart."

[Alex Heat]

 

So Dynasty Warriors Zelda became a thing today.  Given that I didn't enjoy Skyward Sword very much, I will gladly accept this to tide me over in the meantime, since at least I know what to expect here.  All the better if has some co-op play.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Alex Heat

[Mr. GOH!]

Do people like the characters and worldbuilding in Zelda more than the gameplay and game design? Because this seems like out-and-out brand dilution consisting of a Zelda skin for Dynasty Warriors. It might be a good game, it just doesn't seem like a real Zelda game.

 

Edit: But I can see how this may factor into Nintendo's desperate need to appeal to hardcore(?) gamers who, in Asia, at least, may be huge Dynasty Warriors fans. I have no idea if this will help salvage the Wii U's tragic sales figures or not.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Mr. GOH!

[Saturnine Tenshi]

Basically what GOH said.

[TheMightyEthan]

They did go out of their way to say this isn't a real entry in the Legend of Zelda series.

[Mr. GOH!]

I'm not sure what effect their avowals that this isn't a "real" Zelda game will have on sales numbers. Likely minor, since I don't think many folks care about the distinction between "real" and non-real entries into the Legend of Zelda series.

[TheMightyEthan]

I think the point is probably just to reassure people that this is just a spinoff and not a change in the direction of the series.

[Waldorf and Statler]

Started ALBW yesterday. I just got the three anal beads and the master sword. So far it's an ok game, I'm enjoying it as much as I enjoy your standard Zelda title. The 3D effects are kind of cool and the wall painting thing admittedly looks super sweet.

 

But besides that it hasn't blown my mind. I still insist, unlike them nostalgia filled goggles, that the move to 3D really helped Zelda.

 

Sure, one of my favorite titles is Spirit Tracks, but that's more due to it having the best Zelda/Link relationship. Not the camera.

[TCP]

If this is to tide people over till the real Zelda game, I would have much rather had Twilight Princess HD. Double hook shots, yo!

[TCP]

Sure, one of my favorite titles is Spirit Tracks, but that's more due to it having the best Zelda/Link relationship. Not the camera.

 

[Waldorf and Statler]

Like I said that statement is entirely due to the characters. Favorite would probably be Wind Waker, OoT or Majora's Mask. And as much hate as it gets, I loved Skyward Sword for the story and characters as well.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Waldorf and Statler

[TCP]

Skyward Sword was the best characters and story in a Zelda for sure. Too bad the overworld sucked. And the volcano area music. Oh god...

[Mr. GOH!]

Everything after Link to the Past is utter bullshit. 

[WhitePawn]

Started ALBW yesterday. I just got the three anal beads and the master sword. So far it's an ok game, I'm enjoying it as much as I enjoy your standard Zelda title. The 3D effects are kind of cool and the wall painting thing admittedly looks super sweet.

 

But besides that it hasn't blown my mind. I still insist, unlike them nostalgia filled goggles, that the move to 3D really helped Zelda.

 

This is basically my feels. It's not often I say that about a Zelda title. Just don't feel driven to really finish it. Soundtrack is boss as fuck. People say the last dungeon is one of the best in recent Zelda memory, so. -shrug-

[deanb]

[CorgiShinobi]

Maybe some of you have heard Hyrule Warriors will be playable as E3. Maybe some of you have even seen some screenshots of the game and characters.

 

Just saying, this'll probably be the most boob the Zelda franchise will ever feature.

 

EDIT: If you want other screens, here.

Edited May 22, 2014 by Atomsk88

[Mal]

I honestly forgotten about Hyrule Warriors. So, who's the Lu Bu?

[TheMightyEthan]

You're forgetting about the fairies from Ocarina of Time!  Damn they were hot...

 

 

 

[CorgiShinobi]

As much as I want to tell myself it's foliage, as a kid, it always looked like she had a skin condition.

 

No amount of eye makeup and hi-top boots will hide it, Great Fairy!

[FMW]

Hyrule Warriors is absolutely an example of brand dilution because I can guarantee you right now it's going to feature both more simplistic violent gameplay AND the characters/world building are getting filtered through the pervy anime lens that all Japanese games from Team Ninja go through.  Lots of boob, lots of violence, very "pretty" faces in an anime kind of way.

 

Here's the story behind the story:  to make more money in this hour when they aren't making so much money, Nintendo is looking to license out their properties to other companies.  There's a whole new division working on this shit.  But there's a problem - Nintendo are looking primarily to license their properties with Japanese companies.  That isn't a problem as far as getting comics or figurines or posters or whatever.  Japan is doing those things fine.  But games?  The Japanese game scene is in absolute tatters!  Real talk:  which Japanese developers are making better games than Nintendo these days?

 

So yeah, Hyrule Warriors doesn't look great.  Team Ninja and Techmo-Koei are working on this.  So we can expect bewbs and violence and crappy music.

 

The question is, who's gonna do any better?  Square Enix is dysfunctional.  Namco is already working on Smash Bros.  Atlus is already working on Fire Emblem.  Konami is dysfunctional.  Compile Heart is the worst thing in the world.  SEGA have some good RTS studios but their Japanese division hasn't output impressive first party content in forever.

 

Like, Capcom and Level 5 are about it.  Those two can still make great games.