Destiny

[deanb]

 

Japanese trailer

[danielpholt]

So maybe this has been asked before, but is anyone planning on waiting for the PC release?  I wasn't planning on picking it up at all, but I think I may be able to fit a tiny amount of Destiny into my life before it...all...goes...mental... in a few months, and that's all the excuse I need. PC seems to be the way to go but I thought I'd gauge the temperature in here before taking the plunge. 

[TheMightyEthan]

I was planning to wait for PC before I decided not to get it at all.

[Mal]

I was planning on getting it on PC but you know... the game is really suffering from a death of a thousand cuts but all those pesky micro-transactions. Like how some people draw the line at Denuvo, I draw the line with the micro-transaction fuckery. Very similar case with Shadow of War.

[CorgiShinobi]

Haven't touched micro-transactions. There's no reason for me to touch them unless I was lazy and didn't want to play the game. For people who want more shiny stuff right away, I think there's fault on their part. They're so willing to throw down more real world money at this game that's not even a week old.

 

I mean, I've personally spent money on Overwatch's Loot Boxes because those circumvented time with money during a limited time event. It even unlocked quite a bit of cosmetic stuff when you're fresh to the game and didn't have hours to grind for wins or levels.

 

Here in Destiny, the grind is part of the game where you're going on Adventures, Strikes, the Crucible, and even the Raid (soon). You're just doing yourself a disservice if you want to skip playing the game just to advance in an arbitrary way. No amount of Light Level or Exotics is going to replace skill. The number of Lv. 20 LL 240+ I've slaughtered in Crucible as a Lv. 10 Arcstrider with only a Rare level Auto Rifle can attest to that.

[Mr. GOH!]

However you wanna rationalize that gambling problem, man.

[CorgiShinobi]

If you fall for it, it is gambling. Either you love to grind, or you love to gamble. This is a growing concern in the industry because even if you get things "on return," value is dictated to the user. Ergo, loophole prompting users to gamble again to get what they want.

 

I've stopped buying Overwatch Loot Boxes bee tee dubs. After two events where I still never got the stuff I wanted, and how credits are pretty much a pipe dream, I just became detached to flashy cosmetics.

 

I was never going to buy Silver in D2 after the fiasco that was the second Festival of the Lost. I can live without goodies, especially in a game where there's going to be something new and better down the line.

 

EDIT: I only brought up Overwatch because, mechanically, it's a game that doesn't stress upon it's Loot Boxes as progress. It's purely cosmetic. However, people feel justified in buying them because constant losing and time limitation in their daily life adds a desire to obtain them quickly rather than naturally. So they casually fall into a cycle of spending money because they can't spend time. The Arcade, which is suppose to be focused on fun, has become toxic because people want the Loot Boxes offered weekly through 9 wins. Things is, they might have to play 20 matches, maybe 10 minutes each, to get those Loot Boxes.

Edited September 9, 2017 by Atomsk88

[Hot Heart]

Yeah, absolutely no need to buy Silver. You get a bright engram every time you level up past 20 and they give you cool stuff. I've already got a Sparrow, an exotic weapon ornament (skin), a sweet-looking chestpiece and an "exotic" emote among other things. I've got more than enough shaders and bits and pieces from playing the regular content, too.

 

And the "buy-to-win" mods? You get them all over the place and particularly from the Gunsmith, which is easy to rank up since all your Rare and above weapons give you gun parts (which aren't needed for levelling up guns because that's not a thing anymore).

[CorgiShinobi]

Also, people want to say it's like "Pay-to-Win," but what exactly are people winning? Even if they get high Light Levels, that doesn't do you any good in Crucible. I'm still going to kick your ass at LL 150 if you can't aim and abandon your team. The only PvE activity that could benefit from this is being artificially prepared for the Raid. Still, the way the game is designed, you can't just pay your way to true progress. Because there's still RNG, and that Infusion is more demanding, you'd have to throw so much money at it. Likewise, you could instead easily accomplish this progress by doing some fun as hell PvE activities.

 

Like I said, people who pay Silver are basically not wanting to play the game. If they want to say they don't have time to play, then maybe Destiny 2 isn't for them. You're suppose to go out in the field (or the Crucible), maybe with friends, and get lost in the world. Along the way you get loot and other goodies and good times are had by all.

[Mal]

My ultimate problem with these micro-transactions and especially those that buy power is that the devs (e.g., Bungie, Monolith) will make changes to the gameplay to encourage these micro-transactions. Even if you don't partake in the micro-transactions it will still affect your game. Right now it is kind of subtle but give it some time and we'll get some egregious cases pop up.

[CorgiShinobi]

But that never happened in Destiny 1, the birthplace of Eververse.

 

 They'd have to do a overhaul of the game's mechanical nature to Light Level, Armor, and Weapons. Right now they're all for the better because there's no leveling up of any new equipment. There's a focus now on customizing the weapons, but ultimately there's nothing drastically significant to the modifications. In the Crucible, everyone is equal aside from class abilities and teamwork. I didn't need an Exotic or Legendary gear to get my first team wipe. I was just Lv 3 with LL 54. EDIT: If anyone wants proof, I still have the match recorded.

 

There's really no point to being better dressed than others in PvE right now. Maybe during a Raid you'll be perceived as better, but ultimately it will come down to your teamwork and tactical skill. I'm sure there will be a meta sooner or later, but you can't truly buy your way into that with RNG.

Edited September 10, 2017 by Atomsk88

[Mister Jack]

Didn't they already make cosmetic skins a consumable item instead of a permanent one?

[TheMightyEthan]

7 hours ago, Mister Jack said:

Didn't they already make cosmetic skins a consumable item instead of a permanent one?

 

Exactly, making the game worse/more grindy to encourage microtransactions.  Sure the skins are just cosmetic, not required, but it's still a little change to push you in that direction.

[CorgiShinobi]

Shaders, the thing that changes the color of your weapons, armor, and ships. It sucks, but the community has also adamantly spoken against it.

 

I've also gained a collection of 50+ shaders just by normally playing the game for 12 hours. What sucks is that if you like to customize, it limits how often you can mix and match. So it's not an issue of "I don't have enough," it's that a simple mechanic from D1 has a sense of commitment to it now.

 

It artificially adds to the grind, but is not remedied by buying Bright Engrams. I feel like a damn parrot, but you get all this stuff easily by playing the game normally. Just no will ever say to themselves, "Man, I want to run the Raid again for the Raid shader!"

 

It's like Bungie didn't stress to Activision the Y1 joke known as Chatterwhite.

[Hot Heart]

So, I finished the story and managed to do the first nightfall. I think I've played enough to put a reasonable amount of thoughts together on all manner of topics: story, weapon/ammo changes, subclasses and abilities, strikes, patrols, nightfall and crucible.

 

Up front, I will say that I am liking it a lot. Nearly everything they have changed has been for the better and it shows that the only major thing people are moaning about is the shaders.

 

So, firstly, the story. The main questline is pretty simple but that's obviouisly because it's mostly for the new people, so as to draw you in. After the cool opening, it's got the basic structure of going to a new place, seeing a new enemy and helping a new character with something before moving on. Which is perfectly fine because it's when you go back to these places afterwards and do all the "Adventures" (of which there are loads) that you get a bunch more story on what's going on, lore stuff, etc. The actual story has some decently-drawn characters but it never rises to anything special; it's "functional".

 

However, the best thing about the main story is that the missions now have a real Halo vibe to them. I mean, the Destiny 1 missions -- structure rather than story wise -- were okay and got better with the expansions but this is on a whole other level I'd almost forgotten Bungie could do. The environments and your paths through them are so much cooler and it has some big setpieces towards the latter half. I think even playing it solo (which I did towards the end as I got fed up waiting for my fireteam) is a good experience.

 

And the weapon changes. It does feel different, but the combinations still present options with close-range and long-range. The changes to the way energy types work against shields also means it's no longer punishing you for not covering all the different energy types and, in fact, gives you a bonus instead. What has changed? Well, most obviously, all energy weapons work better against shields than kinetic weapons. Yes, they all work the same regardless of which energy type is shooting which energy type except if it does match then when the shield pops it causes a little explosion that does AoE damage and stuns that enemy briefly.

 

And the way power ammo works feels pretty well tuned (for strikes and missions anyway) because there are now two tiers of tougher enemy that always drop it. Where it was yellow health bars for "majors" now it has one in-between red and yellow, which is... you've guessed it... orange. So, whenever you kill one of these orange or yellow guys you are guaranteed a power ammo pack on top of the ones regular enemies might drop. Ammo feels fairly plentiful although, sometimes, I've fallen short if I lean too heavily on only one of kinetic or energy rather than switching between them more regularly.

 

As for the subclasses and abilities, these recharge faster than in the beta and you get all sorts of armour perks to improve it as well. Also, most grenades hit like a truck now... except for the stickies, which is annoying (especially since they still have the exotic which gives you two) and clearly a PvP-led change (since people could get close stick you and earn an easy kill). I'm liking the change to Sunsingers (apart from not getting a shield on melee) so the super is no longer about holding it just in case. However, my absolute favourite class and build at the moment (which I would share a video of if PS Share and YouTube weren't being shit) is the Voidwalker "Devour" build. It's a sort of risk/reward, tanky, ad-clearing combination of abilities where you trigger the devour effect either by consuming your grenade or getting an ability melee kill and then every time you kill an enemy you instantly get full health, while it also recharges your other abilities faster. And you've got a 9-second countdown that resets each kill, so it's fairly easy to keep it going and clear a whole room.

 

And I've really liked all the new strikes I've seen so far. The one in the beta is definitely the longest, but they're all a decent length and keep things moving along pretty well. They're not so much raid-lite as some of the later ones in D1 became but there are some interesting twists here and there.

 

Patrols or should I say patrol areas have had some quite significant changes, actually. The general structure is still there, while lots of tweaks and improvements have been made. Firstly, since all the weapon and armour levelling/upgrading is gone, you're no longer farming different materials just to unlock a node. There's no collecting bounties as much as there are just little challenges. Essentially, you're doing a few things in these spaces which all lead towards tokens you trade in with that world's vendor to earn reputation and earn packages. So you still loot chests and collect materials, but you're just trading them in for rep. Lost sectors are fun little diversions that get you loot (good until you hit 265) and tokens. The other main things are adventures which are fairly substantial side quests with a lot more world-building and story content and then there are public events. Public events are now shown on the bloody in-game map WITH COUNTDOWNS AND EVERYTHING. This means people will find it easier to group up with other random guardians and even try and trigger the "heroic" versions of these public events to earn better loot. It's all good changes, really.

 

The nightfall has undergone another change, where you can all die and not be kicked to orbit (or even a checkpoint) but it's like a time attack mode where you earn time for kills (but it's still better to leg it through as much as you can). This week has a rotating burn modifier (which also punishes using the wrong type) but it only shows up on the "news feed" in the bottom left (where it says kills, revives, super activations and stuff) when it switches, so you really have to look for it and communciate with your team if you spot it.

 

I've only played a bit of crucible but it's been pretty good, since my friends and I make up 3/4 of a fireteam now. We've dominated all but one match we've played so far and had a really tight 26-25 game of supremacy (which I hated in 6v6) but I kinda miss those 6v6 games for stuff like control. The weapon changes are really welcome here and it's obviously closer to the older Halo model of having a "power weapon spawn" where only one person gets it... except there is one for each team (technically). Not sure if I'll attempt Trials but we'll see.

 

And, yeah, there are so many little quality-of-life changes that are welcome and there's probably a ton of little things that I haven't covered. Overall, though, loving it.

 

[CorgiShinobi]

I've gotten Orpheus Rig to drop twice, which is the best Hunter PvE Exotic Armor. I also have Mechaneer's Tricksleeves, which are really only for Sidearms. Still, there are some impressive sidearms in this game, so I use it for PvP.

 

Today though I got the PS Exclusive Borealis from an Exotic from Shaxx. Being able to change the element type... Oh baby!

[Hot Heart]

Solo queued for Crucible and, whether or not it's because it's still adjusting as the system "learns" player skill levels, I had a fun time. I can see how it might get annoying if you keep running into a heavily coordinated team of MIDA users but I think the sweaty players will gravitate towards the Competitive playlist and Trials.

 

 

Edited October 7, 2017 by Hot Heart
Fix video

[Mr. GOH!]

"Also, people want to say it's like "Pay-to-Win," but what exactly are people winning?"

 

It's true; there is little that is as pointless as Destiny.

[CorgiShinobi]

"It's true; there is little that is as pointless as Destiny."

 

It's true; there is little that is as pointless as 'err_missing_game'. What value does 'err_missing_game' provide besides relative entertainment? I think we would all be better off if we went outside and helped build our local communities rather than 'err_missing_game' so called "communities." And another thing...

[Hot Heart]

Having played it for a month now, I definitely sense the change in design philosophy.

 

I think anyone who's worried about Destiny eating up all their time has nothing to worry about now. Bungie have said that if people are getting fed up with Destiny, they should take time away and play other games and they've certainly made changes to support that.

 

I touched on the changes to patrol and weapon/gear levelling, and it's actually really refreshing. You don't have to farm materials, you don't have to keep hoping for that decent roll on a piece of gear, you don't even have to worry about the element type on your energy weapons. No more worrying about grabbing bounties.

 

Each week, you've got your core elements of progression in the form of "milestones" which are shown clearly on the director screen: flashpoint (public events on that week's chosen world), crucible kills & assists (a total requirement which has been greatly reduced as well), nightfall and raid. Plus, extras for being in a clan. Once you've done them, you really don't have to play any more. Obviously, there are lots of little things you can work on but, essentially, you are playing for the joy of playing not because you feel you need to.

 

I mean, part of me misses that min-maxing and flexibility and experimentation with abilities but I think that stuff will be built on more as Bungie feels comfortable. Destiny 2 really has been stripped back to a (still fun) core experience for getting new people onboard first.

[CorgiShinobi]

I do hope that we can eventually customize our weapons with perks instead of just shaders. Legendary Engrams just aren't as special once you have most gear and weapons. I enjoy most of the changes, but don't tell that to the diehard player base because they want the old D1 Y1 grind back. Baffles me why anyone would want to go back to resource farming for perk unlocks.

 

The major complaint I have is the Crucible. I don't like how it's two playlists and you're at the mercy of fate on what game you'll play. I hate Supremacy, even though I'm Gold ELO in it. I haven't touched Competitive in weeks because it's too slow and once someone leaves, you're guaranteed to lose. Overall, I wish abilities charged faster. Using guns 90% of the time gets boring and you don't have all the crazy moments like in D1. Not to mention you get your Super a maximum of two times IF you collect Orbs of Light from teammates and use your first Super once it's ready (or around it).

 

EDIT: But to add to Hot Heart's comment, if you guys were scared of grinding and this eating your life away, it doesn't have the extent to do so with the QoL changes. If you haven't visited r/DestinytheGame in the last few weeks, you'll see a trend of "hardcore" players going off about how they don't have a grind and that there's no endgame. There is one, but it's admittedly finite. Once you have a Legendary weapon, you have the same one everyone else does as perks are fixed. There's no grind for godrolls or elusive materials. So once you're done with the Weekly Reset and Milestones, you're left with doing the Raid some more, some Trials of the Nine, and whatever else you want to personally do.

 

I'm being harsh on the dedicated players a bit, but for the majority of people they've got their money's worth. It's not blasphemous if you play other games between sessions and putting in a damn RNG-based grind will not be incentive for most to stay in the game.

Edited October 8, 2017 by Atomsk88

[deanb]

So what's the PC player base for this looking like on here? Tempted to grab it through GMG (since they're currently the cheapest best I can tell) but mainly if I know folks are picking it up.

[TheMightyEthan]

I'm staying away.

[TheMightyEthan]

Or at least I was until you started asking and now I'm super tempted...

[deanb]

 

Well I did a poll and like half of people were grabbing it.