Steam Console

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

I'd be shocked if they actually developed a custom OS, I'd expect it to be more like a Steam Big Picture environment running on top of Windows. It may not look like Windows to the user, but it's got to be there.

 

I would even go as far to say that you probably wont be able to access windows on this machine. It just runs windows secretly, in the background. Probably customized enough so somethings that are memory eaters that allow windows to run certain things to be turned off. I don't know much about programming, but it is my understanding that Windows has a lot of processess running that are not essential to running Windows itself, but essential to running Windows as a full experience. Maybe those will be eliminated in the programming?

 

Also, because the Xbox uses Direct X, does it run a heavily optimized version of Windows?

 

I'm fairly certain you can't license Windows and do any of this. Microsoft does this because they're motherfuckin' Microsoft.

[deanb]

If folks are taking issue with Thursdays "build a HTPC" then just buy one pre-built. You're going to get the exact same experience. Valve have zero fingers in the hardware industry too so you're not going to be getting it any cheaper than existing HTPCs. As established Valve have no power to change Windows, so installing Steam and booting up Big Picture on Steam start is going to be the exact same experience too. And if it wa to use Linux (thus drecreasing cost, and bypassing the whole "You can't make Steam run over Windows" thing, you lose 99% of games in the Library. If you're currently on an underpowered rig because you can't afford a high-end rig, what is it you're expecting from a cheap "Steambox" HTPC?

Also there has been nothing said, even in the original Kotaku article, about them making a custom OS.

 

@Madbass: No Xbox is not running Windows. The original Xbox ran a WinNT base, but once again isn't Windows. One of the big giveaways is 360 is a PowerPC architecture and Windows up until WindowsRT has only ever supported X86.

[madbassman39]

I think the advantage a Steambox might have over an HTPC that you can purchase and download steam on, is the fact that it will be marketed for the specific reason of playing games. Most people who are into gaming will know that this isn't all that different, but I have friends who will not buy a gaming PC because its "too confusing." They say "well I know any Xbox game I buy plays on my Xbox, I don't have to check requirements minimum/recommended." The steam box will alleviate some of this confusion for those people if they can buy a game that says "Steambox" on it.

[deanb]

Which brings us back to my initial point of just having a reference system like the Windows Experience Program. Or the recently announced/currently beta's Geforce Experience.

 

btw one of the advantages of building your own PC is knowing exactly what is under the hood, so you can match it up with what the game requires. A pre-built loses some of that ability, and if you're going to just rely on games having a "works on Steambox lv2" then folks will likely become complacent and be even less averse to experience PC gaming unless it comes with a "it's okay to buy this game" sticker (of course that thinking does hugely work in Valves favour. You're not going to attempt to buy games from other services that use "System Requirements" instead of Steambox ratings)

[Vecha]

Maybe Valve will partner with Microsoft for the X-St®eam box! Whoa man!

Edited December 13, 2012 by Vecha

[deanb]

Hehehe.

[Thursday Next]

You don't have to be tech smart to build a PC. I'm just a lawyer and I built one. The problems I see with this are:

 

1. If it is cheap enough to compete with console prices it won't be as powerful.

2. If it is as powerful as consoles it will be more expensive.

3. Even if they do somehow make it as cheap as and as powerful as a console it will still soon be obsolete.

4. If it uses just a steam OS then it will not have the Netflix / iPlayer etc. features that consoles have.

5. If it uses Windows, then you might as well build (or get an off-the shelf) HTPC, which will do games, video, music, etc...

 

While people making games for consoles know that they have to stick within the console limits PC games are not similarly restricted so a SteamBox that is released today and can run games on high, will, within six to twelve months be running games on low, and within a couple of years will be able to run bugger all.

[FredEffinChopin]

You don't have to be tech smart to build a PC. I'm just a lawyer and I built one. The problems I see with this are:

 

I wasn't going to mention her on a forum, but to drive a point home that nobody seems to want to acknowledge:

 

My mother does some gaming. My mother cannot program her favorites channels on cable; I assure you, she cannot assemble a PC. I need to check on her PC periodically just to make sure that she hasn't ruined it by interacting with it on a software level. It's a disaster. She's not an isolated case either. She's not an idiot by any means, she's a professional, educated woman. It's just not within the spectrum of her experience, and it's unlikely that she's about to start learning; certainly not for the possibility of playing more games. She has never had the realistic option of PC gaming, in other words.

 

I didn't need to go to an extreme by bringing her up, as I have friends my age who are similarly unequipped for such activity (and as I don't like opening my mother up to discussion), but again, I want to drive the point home that there are definitely entry-level requirements to PC gaming that many people cannot, and likely will not meet. Those people have traditionally gamed on consoles. BPM does some of the job of bridging that gap by creating an interface with which you don't need a physical platform in front of you (for the kb/m) to interact with your games library in a living room setting. If a Steam platform were to release that behaved like a console, they will have succeeded in making themselves available to an entire new audience that has been sitting under their noses all along.

[Thursday Next]

But if you are so ignorant as to gaming and technology in general, why would you even look twice at a Steam Console? While it has a huge number of casual titles, Steam is not aimed at the mum market. That position is already filled by the Wii. Steam doesn't have anything like a big enough brand to take on Nintendo in the casual living room gaming space.

[FredEffinChopin]

Because it's easier to play a game than it is to put together a PC to play one. I never said that she plays Farmville. She plays plenty of titles designated as "hardcore" (I believe she is playing Mass Effect 3 atm). Not well, but she plays and enjoys them. She's never thought about a Steam console, and never will if it isn't brought to her attention. I might buy it for her though, if it seems to be something that might be suited to her. She appreciates cheap and plentiful games just like anyone else.

[TheMightyEthan]

Well and the fact that the Steam brand isn't big in that market right now doesn't mean it would be completely impossible for them to enter that space. All brands have to start somewhere.

 

The biggest problem I see is that a large portion of their library still doesn't support controller input. More and more games every day do, but I still don't think it's anywhere close to being the majority (disclaimer: I have no actual numbers to back that up, that's just the impression I've gotten).

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

Because it's easier to play a game than it is to put together a PC to play one. I never said that she plays Farmville. She plays plenty of titles designated as "hardcore" (I believe she is playing Mass Effect 3 atm). Not well, but she plays and enjoys them. She's never thought about a Steam console, and never will if it isn't brought to her attention. I might buy it for her though, if it seems to be something that might be suited to her. She appreciates cheap and plentiful games just like anyone else.

 

ME3 is hardcore? What.

 

Just because a game isn't casual FB shit doesn't make it hardcore

[Thursday Next]

But that is already well catered for by Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo. I don't see what Steam has to offer on top of that?

[TheMightyEthan]

Steam sales.

 

@FDS: I believe he just meant "core". And if you don't consider ME3 a core game then you're using a different definition that everyone else.

[FredEffinChopin]

@Ethan

Yeah, I'm sure you're right about a huge portion of the library not supporting controllers, especially older titles. The newer stuff does largely support it though, enough so that I've barely touched my kb/m in-game

 

@FDS

My point isn't to sit here and make claims about what is included under the umbrella of "hardcore". Perhaps the people feel like ME is a bit hand-holdy, but I mention it because it's certainly within the sights of what is called a hardcore gamer's interest; the series if not the game. My point is that she plays plenty of games that aren't marketed towards her, or treated as mom games in some way.

 

@TN

That same argument would go for any console-owner who decides to start gaming on the PC (if one is looking for reasons not-to game on the PC), so I'll offer myself as an example. The sales were the #1 deciding factor for me, but there are also a good deal of games that wouldn't be available to me on the PS3, and since most of those on Xbox are also on PC, it made sense for me. It's mainly the cheap games, though.

[deanb]

Why are people still acting like the only way into pc gaming is to build it. It's like talking about hunting a cow to make xmas lunch, sure you could, byt there's plenty alternative Options.

 

Also Steam PC not console.

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

it's certainly within the sights of what is called a hardcore gamer's interest; the series if not the game.

 

Sorry, but I don't think the usage of the word "casual gamer" has turned the word "gamer" to mean "hardcore gamer."

 

If ME3 is hardcore what do we call actual hardcore games and not mass produced super friendly titles like ME3?

[FredEffinChopin]

Bang for the buck. Generally, already-built PCs that are worth anything game-wise aren't especially affordable. A reasonably-priced Dell (or similarly branded) PC struggles to play games that are old for the time it's released; I've tried. Many of these things have integrated graphics that you can't really do a whole lot with.

 

While the "Steambox" might not be a console per se, I think the whole point of releasing one, and with coming out with BPM, is to streamline the experience for people, and make as accessible as a console. Steam itself (in its way) unifies the gaming platform, BPM makes it available in an environment that doesn't require a kb/m, and the Steambox gives a solid price point at which buyers can be confident that it'll run everything. Also, I'd imagine that I Steambox would aim to go even a step further and be entirely controller-friendly. Of course we don't know that yet, but I think it would be a really smart move if they can swing it. It effectively is a console if they do that, and can appeal to a broader audience.

 

*EDIT*

@FDS

I feel like my use of the term was pretty clear in its purpose, but I see your point. I have mostly used it to designate a type of gamer, rather than a type of game though; and in turn, reference games that appeal to the experienced gamer as "hardcore". In other words, yes, I equated hardcore with non-casual. If we're talking about how hardcore a game can be, then perhaps I am throwing the word around a bit liberally.

Edited December 13, 2012 by FredEffinChopin

[Thursday Next]

@Ethan: Crystal ball gazing: There is no way that a new home entertainment device is going to join or supplant Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft in the living room for gaming, not unless they've got the reach of Apple or Samsung. Certainly not if we're looking at people's mums or other casual / core (but not FDS hardcore) gamers.

 

If you are a PC gamer, and you want PC gaming in your living room, there are plenty of solutions for that already. If you are a console gamer, there are no benefits to going to Steam on a mid tier box and you're probably already balls deep into your platform of choice. I've got too much Sony content to jump ship to a Steam console / PC and I only have space / time in my living room for one console so I'm not going to double up.

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

there are no benefits to going to Steam on a mid tier box and you're probably already balls deep into your platform of choice

 

That would make sense if there wasn't a new generation of consoles coming up. Now is the perfect time to launch this.

[Thorgi Duke of Frisbee]

there are no benefits to going to Steam on a mid tier box and you're probably already balls deep into your platform of choice

 

That would make sense if there wasn't a new generation of consoles coming up. Now is the perfect time to launch this.

I guess the question is whether they can release it in time to take advantage of the market.

[Waldorf and Statler]

Why are we assuming that if they release a Steambox that it won't be as powerful as a mid/upper-tier PC? If they can somehow cut deals to get parts for cheap they could easily sale this for $500. Will they? Probably not but something as powerful as next-gen consoles, which will be around mid-tier PC's when they come out, won't be bad at all. Especially since companies developing for the PC and 360 won't have to move away too far to develop for this (unless it's Linux based).

 

And Ethan mentioned a good point with the controllers. The problem of us still speculating this early in the point, with no information whatsoever to go on, is that we'll be in an alternating wave of good and bad-hopes for it. I hope they release more info before the next-gen consoles are announced. Or maybe in the same E3, who knows.

[madbassman39]

See! This discussion is exciting! All based on the fact that Steam is serious about making a Steambox! Look at all the possibilities that it could be based on the possibilities that we can think of. I don't think anyone here is a market analyst, so these are all speculation based off of common knowledge. This discusion pretty much sums up why I think the Steambox will change the console market. Even if it isn't a roaring success, it is something everybody is curious about, bridging the gap between consoles and PCs. Good stuff.

 

New thought here that just came up.

What if its a base box that has easy to replace components, and you buy stuff like graphics cards that are lvl 1,2,3 and so on. Easy to understand, easy to remove and replace. No real computer knowledge involved. Want to play Farcry 3? You need a lvl 2 graphics, lvl 1 processor, lvl 2 ram. Easy! Steam boxes come in various SKUs, lvl 1, 2, and 3 (more for future proofing). Maybe thats just complicating things even more, but I feel like its easier to understand.

[deanb]

Bang for the buck. Generally, already-built PCs that are worth anything game-wise aren't especially affordable. A reasonably-priced Dell (or similarly branded) PC struggles to play games that are old for the time it's released; I've tried. Many of these things have integrated graphics that you can't really do a whole lot with.

I don't get why people seem to think Valve would be able to escape this fact. It's either going to be a PC you can throw everything at, in which case not especially affordable. Or it'll be affordable and provide middling gaming capabilities. btw most motherboards come with PCI-E slots, so you could always throw in a GPU to instantly boost gaming capabilities and over ride the integrated GPU.

 

@Madbass: Sure it's making discussion, but it's just that. Also you'll never get "Level 1 processors" "Level 2 graphics etc, Intel and co can't have that. Especially if it clearly marks out particular CPUs/GPUs as being on-par with each other despite a $100 mark-up on the second one.

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

I don't get why people seem to think Valve would be able to escape this fact. It's either going to be a PC you can throw everything at, in which case not especially affordable. Or it'll be affordable and provide middling gaming capabilities. btw most motherboards come with PCI-E slots, so you could always throw in a GPU to instantly boost gaming capabilities and over ride the integrated GPU.

 

You're making the assumption that Valve won't be able to cut deals and/or sell at a loss here. You're assuming they're just ordering parts off of NewEgg and throwing it together and then selling that.