Broken Age

[deanb]

So what was the Kickstarter'd Double Fine Adventure is now Broken Age.

 

 

http://www.brokenagegame.com/

 

Somewhat scarce on details so far, at least for non-backers.

[toxicitizen]

It now has a teaser trailer.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BWM4R5JsakE

 

Gotta say, I really love the art style.

[deanb]

So Broken Age needs more money to complete the game. This is despite getting $3million more than the originally needed. Oh and the game won't be done for another year and then some. 

 

So yeah, it's hilariously overbudget, and hilariously massively late. And if the Steam Early Access plan doesn't work and raise a further $4million or whatever they need to finish the other half of the game (which can't blame folks for being cautious now, not many folks will pre-order a game that the devs have admitted they can't finish), then those original backers get to go home with an unfinished game. Hooray for Double Fine showing nil respect to peoples trust and money. Hooray for them being unable to look back on past projects, asses thier over-budget projects and go "hmm, how can we improve, instead of still going over budget when we get 8X what we asked for?". But hey, it's Tim Schafer, and the fact people love his past games (but not publishers) he'll get a free pass on fucking up a budget that was $3million in excess. And folks think gov'ts overspend!

[Mal]

Some enormous amount of feature creep going on. Its fine to add stuff from the extra dosh you got but come on. I think this is the part where "stretch goals" come in... it is essential the feature creep but solidified. You'll know where you stand with any extra money. I'm looking at the Kickstarter now, it is pretty much "the sky is the limit" when it comes to adding stuff on. Add in a creative mind and well, it'll be bad and we get this.

 

Edit: Also I never really taken a look at the Kickstarter but yeah. It totally is a "come up with it as we go" scenario. Doesn't seem like even DF eve knew what exactly they were making. It was just a point-and-click adventure game.

 

Edit edit: Seems like they really started work on the project after it was fully funded. So yeah, the problem.

 

Compare this Kickstarter with Massive Chalice. Massive Chalice got shit planned.

Edited July 3, 2013 by MaliciousH

[Saturnine Tenshi]

Hahaha. This is the one time when I was grateful for a Kotaku link.

[deanb]

 

A Note from Tim

Hello, Backers of Adventure!

Those of you who have been following along in the documentary know about the design vs. money tension we’ve had on this project since the early days. Even though we received much more money from our Kickstarter than we, or anybody anticipated, that didn’t stop me from getting excited and designing a game so big that it would need even more money.

I think I just have an idea in my head about how big an adventure game should be, so it’s hard for me to design one that’s much smaller than Grim Fandango or Full Throttle. There’s just a certain amount of scope needed to create a complex puzzle space and to develop a real story. At least with my brain, there is.

So we have been looking for ways to improve our project’s efficiency while reducing scope where we could along the way. All while looking for additional funds from bundle revenue, ports, etc. But when we finished the final in-depth schedule recently it was clear that these opportunistic methods weren’t going to be enough.

We looked into what it would take to finish just first half of our game—Act 1. And the numbers showed it coming in July of next year. Not this July, but July 2014. For just the first half. The full game was looking like 2015! My jaw hit the floor.

This was a huge wake-up call for all of us. If this were true, we weren’t going to have to cut the game in half, we were going to have to cut it down by 75%! What would be left? How would we even cut it down that far? Just polish up the rooms we had and ship those? Reboot the art style with a dramatically simpler look? Remove the Boy or Girl from the story? Yikes! Sad faces all around.

Would we, instead, try to find more money? You guys have been been very generous in the tip jar (thanks!) but this is a larger sum of money we were talking about. Asking a publisher for the money was out of the question because it would violate the spirit of the Kickstarter, and also, publishers. Going back to Kickstarter for it seemed wrong. Clearly, any overages were going to have to be paid by Double Fine, with our own money from the sales of our other games. That actually makes a lot of sense and we feel good about it. We have been making more money since we began self-publishing our games, but unfortunately it still would not be enough.

Then we had a strange idea. What if we made some modest cuts in order to finish the first half of the game by January instead of July, and then released that finished, polished half of the game on Steam Early Access? Backers would still have the option of not looking at it, of course, but those who were sick of waiting wouldn’t have to wait any more. They could play the first half of the game in January!

We were always planning to release the beta on Steam, but in addition to that we now have Steam Early Access, which is a new opportunity that actually lets you charge money for pre-release content. That means we could actually sell this early access version of the game to the public at large, and use that money to fund the remaining game development. The second part of the game would come in a free update a few months down the road, closer to April-May.

So, everybody gets to play the game sooner, and we don’t have to cut the game down drastically. Backers still get the whole game this way—nobody has to pay again for the second half.

And whatever date we start selling the early release, backers still have exclusive beta access before that, as promised in the Kickstarter.

I want to point out that Broken Age’s schedule changes have nothing to do with the team working slowly. They have been kicking ass and the game looks, plays, and sounds amazing. It’s just taking a while because I designed too much game, as I pretty much always do. But we’re pulling it in, and the good news is that the game’s design is now 100% done, so most of the unknowns are now gone and it’s not going to get any bigger.

With this shipping solution I think we’re balancing the size of the game and the realities of funding it pretty well. We are still working out the details and exact dates, but we’d love to hear your thoughts. This project has always been something we go through together and the ultimate solution needs to be something we all feel good about.

In the meantime, I’m hoping you are enjoying the documentary and like the progress you’re seeing on Broken Age. I’m really exciting about how it’s coming together, I can’t wait for you to see more of it, and I feel good about finally having a solid plan on how to ship it!

Thanks for reading,

Tim

 

The message put out to the backers for those interested.

 

And yeah Massive Chalice is substantially more planned out, but I'm gonna take a guess but going of the wording in the backers message "Clearly, any overages were going to have to be paid by Double Fine, with our own money from the sales of our other games." there's a fair degree of chance that it's going to hit a funding issue too unless they use potential profits from this.

Always knew that as a business side of things Double Fine always had issues with project management  but it does seem to be a degree of George Lucas to it, where the man in charge isn't told "no, can't do that" or "no, don't do that".

 

I think their problem is they got in way more than the planned $400K. If that's all they got in they'd likely have stuck to a much more accomplishable goal. As a tweet I saw earlier put it "They planned for $400k, when they got the $3.8million they didn't re-plan". Which is why you end up going from a game that was meant to take 6 months (so oct/nov 2012), now not being due without excess funding until 2015.

[Waldorf and Statler]

Yeah the issue here is they got big heads and didn't manage properly how big they made the game.

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

Yeah the issue here is they got big heads and didn't manage properly how big they made the game.

 

This is stupid. Because studios exceeding their budget/needing their time is such a rare occurrence. Fuck off. They're being honest.

[Hot Heart]

I guess it's a matter of waiting to see what happens, but I'm a little sceptical since they were waaaaay over target already. I've long seen poor planning/management by developers/publishers (usually identifiable by the statement "This game didn't sell a squillion copies, so it was a failure") where it would've been better to examine where the money should be going. To create an adventure game requiring a higher budget than one that was already 800%+ over your original plan (or to axe 75% of the game!) just screams of excess. A crude point to make, but I doubt you can say you'll enjoy the game 800% more than something like Tales of Monkey Island or The Walking Dead.

[deanb]

Yeah they've blown well past their budget despite getting well past what they originally needed, and still looking for more. It doesn't help that Double Fine already have a reputation of going over-budget. I'm mainly just disappointed. I kind of assumed that in doing a Kickstarter they'd maybe step up their game and keep themselves into a slim budget, especially since they're in no position like normal to just ask a publisher for a bit more cash. And if I was Double Fine I'd just be embarrassed that indies on their first game have been able to show greater skill in project and budget management than veterans with decades of experience behind them. They dropped the publisher, but not their mentality of working under one.

[Waldorf and Statler]

 

Yeah the issue here is they got big heads and didn't manage properly how big they made the game.

 

This is stupid. Because studios exceeding their budget/needing their time is such a rare occurrence. Fuck off. They're being honest.

 

 

How about you unclench them buttcheeks and read that sentence again. I never stated I was pissed or disappointed, I stated what happened which is what did happen. The budget was originally $400,000. They made around 7.5 times what they needed. Reality is that they made the project too big, like it or not. Never stated it didn't happen or whether their plan was dumb either. Jesus.

 

You really need to lay off the sarcasm whenever you want to make a point, it doesn't make you look smart as much as it makes you sound like a dick.

 

They started the movement of games in Kickstarter. This sets a bad example for the Kickstarter games and might be used as fuel by those who are already skeptical/hating. Pretending it's not an issue is insane, whether it's a development or situation one.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Waldorf And Statler

[Saturnine Tenshi]

"I wonder what the reaction would be like if it wasn't the loveable squishy face of Tim Schafer heading this fucked project?"

[Mister Jack]

Well, the backers still get the full game, right? This development is embarrassing for them, no disputing that, but I don't think there's any need to get upset if you already put money into the funding to get yourself a copy.

[Waldorf and Statler]

Aren't they getting the first half for sure and the second half only if the sales of the first amount to what they need? Or so I read at first in articles, haven't bothered to read it again

[Mister Jack]

I have no idea how much money they need but they seem confident that alpha access would give it to them. It probably would, too. Brutal Legend did pretty well once it came to steam. If it didn't, then I could understand people being pissed, but I'd be surprised if that happened.

[Hot Heart]

No, you'll still get the full game. I'm just concerned it'll be a bloated hell of a thing, and I'm bad enough with finishing adventure games as it is.

[Waldorf and Statler]

The Walking Dead imho was a step in the right direction for adventure games. Mainly in the aspect of not having to bring out your inventory and attempt random ass combinations. Deponia did this but at least it was comedic in nature as it made no fucking sense at points.

[Thursday Next]

Wouldn't have happened if they'd had EA cracking the whip.

[TheMightyEthan]

Or we just would have stopped hearing about it and in 6 months some executive would comment that "the project is no longer in active development."  

[Waldorf and Statler]

Yeah Ethan. The guys behind The Banner Saga, Stoic Studios, made a comment defending Double Fine in their latest update. For those who don't recall Stoic studios is formed by a couple of former Bioware developers whose major work was The Old Republic, and was the second or third gaming Kickstarter to release after Double Fine got the ball rolling [aka one of the first wave/founding fathers]. I thought the comments were interesting, and though it assumes we don't know anything and sounds a bit condescending it makes sense.

 

 

A CONVERSATION ABOUT KICKSTARTER
Lots of stuff has been going on in the Kickstarter community lately. I'm sure many of you have noticed Double Fine's announcement about splitting up their game into two parts. They've gotten some serious heat for this. Backers of Shadowrun have heard similar things about the content in that game, with the DLC being released much later.

First of all, I want to be clear that we do not intend to do something like this for The Banner Saga. When it releases it will be a complete product. We don't have plans for DLC at this time, and we will continue to support the multiplayer component. We also intend to continue on the sequels (chapter 2 and 3) just as planned.

I would also like to talk about my personal opinion on this, and I'd love to be open and talk like a normal person instead of a PR person in damage control mode. Can we do this? Without freaking out? You can disagree with me of course, just be nice about it.

This is hard. Like, way WAY hard. When we pitched the game we were hoping for enough money to get extra animations, maybe increase the length of the game. We thought we'd get, like, 2000 backers, not 20,000. A fine problem to have, right? Haha! Except that it's actually a huge problem. The hardest problem I've ever dealt with in my life. Now I know.

We thought now we could do everything we ever wanted for the game, and got too ambitious. We thought we could make the game in six months, and I'm still not sure what we were thinking. That was stupid. I wish I could take that back, all we needed to do was put a different date there and nobody would be complaining. Whoops. We ARE still doing everything we want, and it's taking a long time. I don't feel bad about that. That was the POINT, right? To dream as big as we could?

It's interesting to think of it from someone else's point of view. For many people, letting a dev shoot for the moon is NOT the point. For a lot of people the point is I BOUGHT A GAME, WHERE IS IT? They want the biggest, best game ever made, on time, for their $10 contribution. I can see that, too. I don't really agree... but I suppose it's a matter of perspective.

If nothing else, I think the gaming community is finally getting a good picture about real game development. What would really shock people is that there is nothing unusual about any of this, except that you are finally seeing it. This is every game development story that has ever existed, except instead of the publisher dealing with it, YOU are.

Budgets of 1 to 4 million are small-to-medium sized. Our budget of $650k (in actual funding) is relatively small, half a year of production for a small team. Budgets of kickstarter projects asking for $20k... that's not enough to make a game, that's just some content. Surprise! Games you've come to expect as "standard" like Call of Duty: maybe 150 million to make, rough guess. You know how much Old Republic cost? I'm not legally allowed to tell you, actually. It's that much. Now you know.

Games take 1 year to make... if it's a casual iOS game, or an annual sequel. Medium sized games take 2-3 years. Large games take 4-5 years. Believe it or not, lots of games fall in a nebulous space between AAA and "indie", whatever that means. The Old Republic took over 6 years. Yeah, you started hearing about it 1 year before it released. It started production five years before that. For five years hundreds of people toiled on it 12 hours a day and you had no idea! Now you know! Isn't knowing about production right from the start wonderful? No, it's not. It's annoying. It takes FOREVER. That's why you usually don't hear anything until it's almost ready to ship.

Delays, content cuts, pushed back dates, plans to make revenue sooner- this is how games are developed. Bioshock Infinite, the biggest game of 2013, got delayed for half a year, AFTER pre-orders were sold. Journey took 3 years to make a 3 hour game and had to go back for more funding from Sony TWICE. That's how game development goes. They didn't know they'd need to do it. Humans are not good at estimating creative endeavors, no matter how "professional" they are.

We released a truly free demo hoping to make some extra cash for development, and got brutalized for it. But without that income and development time our single-player game wouldn't be as good. Some people will never understand this.

I've worked in games for about a decade. Some companies I worked for had their stuff together better than others. Some were a huge, hundred-million dollar, extremely delayed nightmares. Every company had delays and went over-budget. You know what a release date is? A guess. We're just guessing.

Essentially, I hope people don't freak out too much about what's happening with Kickstarter right now. It's not deceitful or underhanded. It's not a conspiracy. It's normal stuff, whether you like it or not. If Broken Age wasn't a Kickstarter game the first time you would have heard about it would be a couple months from ship, and that it was a two-part adventure game. And you would have been fine with that.

Our game is coming along better than I could have imagined, even if delayed. BECAUSE it's delayed. I'm super happy with it. Other companies have way bigger problems, but that's game development. NOW YOU KNOW. I sincerely hope everything works out the best for them, and you should too. At the end of the day, they're nice guys trying to make good entertainment for you. I, personally, will cut them all the slack in the world.

So there you have it. The games industry! The aristocrats! Maybe it'll get better someday? For now, let's enjoy our time together! (I love you).

-Alex

[Thursday Next]

Or we just would have stopped hearing about it and in 6 months some executive would comment that "the project is no longer in active development."  

 

Maybe, but at least it wouldn't have cost you anything.

[Saturnine Tenshi]

What would really shock people is that there is nothing unusual about any of this, except that you are finally seeing it.

 

Because of poor management. This has been (and remains) an issue in video games. It's gotten better, but that doesn't change the fact. And neither does deflection or intentionally making it out to be something that isn't what it is. It isn't some noble venture in creativity.

Edited July 5, 2013 by Saturnine Tenshi

[TheMightyEthan]

It didn't cost me anything anyway.  
 

It isn't some noble venture in creativity.

Why not?

[Saturnine Tenshi]

Because poor management causes management issues. You aren't allowed to say that something is in need of more funding and/or time because of how amazing your glorious, God-sent creativity is because you don't want to take responsibility (and not be a pretentious prick). Their providential creativity might be a cause of the situation, but not an excuse for it.

 

Man up.

[TheMightyEthan]

Okay, I thought you were saying something like "this is a game, not some artistic endeavor".