Star Wars

[CorgiShinobi]

I'll be seeing the movie tomorrow, but I wanted to hop on the Phantom Menace train. I fully support the use of the film as offering the youth some perspective on what my childhood Star Wars trilogy was like.

 

Granted I did watch the original on VHS when I was younger, but that movie was suppose to be my generation's Star Wars. Instead, wesa got da Jar Jar.

[TCP]

We also got "NOW THIS IS PODRACING" and midiclorians. Also Anakin is immaculate conception like Jesus. But at least that film gave the world Kiera Knightly, so it's not all bad.

[TheMightyEthan]

Holy shit, I didn't even know she was in TPM. Was all ready to tell you you're crazy but decided to check IMDb first just to be sure.

 

I don't think you can say Star Wars gave us her though, cause she was in a number of other minor roles before and after that, and didn't take off until Bend It Like Beckham.

[deanb]

Apparently on set the mums couldn't tell Kiera n Natalie apart when in makeup. 

[CorgiShinobi]

Saw the movie today, as planned, though by the time we got there the seats were almost taken up. Still got good seats, and hell if I'm going to pay for D-Box seats. I like to sit in a seat, not be tossed around as things explode.

 

I've read through most of everyone's spoilers now, so first here's my ranking:

 

1. Empire Strikes Back

2. A New Hope

3. The Force Awakens

4. Return of the Jedi

5. Return of the Sith

6. Attack of the Clones

7. The Phantom Menace

 

I can't really place TFA over New Hope since the film does tend to rely on some throwbacks to said movie. However, that's a good thing because it's like an homage to the original trilogy in how this trilogy will begin too. Never once in the movie did I roll my eyes like I did in the prequels. This feels like a proper continuation and I am excited for the future of Star Wars.

 

Onto spoilers, and some responses to previous spoilers:

 

One thing I would like to stress is that Kylo Ren is not properly trained as a Sith. He's not the next Darth Vader (yet) and he's also not fully immersed in the Dark Side of the Force. Hence, why the fighting with Finn and Rey could wound him further and incapacitate. This is also why the moments when Kylo Ren has his helmet off are important. If he was truly a fully-trained Sith, his physical appearance would show that he is consumed by the Dark Side. He even says to Han, his father, that he is torn inside between the Light and Dark. He prays/pleads to Darth Vader, not Anakin Skywaker, to guide him to the Dark Side. Not to mention Snoke says he'll need to complete Kylo Ren's training.

 

This emphasizes that Kylo Ren is a young man consumed by fear and anger, lashing out with said emotions (a.k.a. his tantrums). Something that Snoke, just like Palpatine with Anakin, is taking advantage of to bring about the First Order. Kylo Ren killing his father is now taking him directly on the path to the Dark Side. I imagine next movie we'll be greeted with some yellow eyes and paler skin to go with his scar.

 

 

On Rey

 

I don't consider her a Mary Sue. Her knowledge of ships and other such tech comes from her life of scavenging Empire and Rebel tech for survival. She's Force sensitive, and we've been led to believe that helps with being a decent pilot too. I suspect she was being contacted by Luke to assist with some of her more Jedi moments like the Mind Trick. Yoda has done this in Rebels with Kanan, so it's not just a Force ghost thing like with Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon (The Clone Wars series).

 

Occam's Razor says she is Luke's daughter. There's too much foreshadowing to this being the case. I would accept that she's the "Lost Apprentice" that escaped the Knights of Ren too. Just, the whole lightsaber with Mas/Moss (?) scene really paints a picture of Anakin's lightsaber being a family heirloom. Hence Ben/Kylo being obsessed with his grandfather's lightsaber too. Speaking of, I thought she was going to be a Jedi all along before the movie, just I also thought Finn might be a Jedi alongside her. Never know, that could be the case later on.

 

 

My gripes:

 

I was okay with the super weapon at first, but I didn't like how the beam is somehow able to precisely split and take out five planets. I thought it was going to borrow the energy of the natural nearby sun and be a long distance Death Star. Instead it eats an entire Sun, hence "Starkiller." I imagine that's also an homage to Anakin/Luke's first draft last name, just as Starkiller was in The Force Unleashed. Anyway, it's not enough to detract my enjoyment, but it's reaching outside my realm of disbelief.

 

Also, there wasn't much screen time for Captain Phasma. I know it's an odd complaint, but the character (wasn't aware going in if the captain was male or female) was marketed quite a bit before the movie. People were kinda suspecting a Boba Fett type character. Well, she's a commanding officer, but we only get 2.5 minutes screen time of her. We get the douche General Hux, a.k.a. Young Space Hitler, much more often as I guess he isn't a fan of Kylo Ren.

 

Not a gripe, just wanted to say I was fine with the map. I mean, you're looking for the only Jedi Master on an entire planet among thousands of other planets. For the First Order, they have a map missing a chunk. I'm sure with time and effort they might narrow it down, but they probably don't have the resources to spend how long it would take to locate one elusive person. For the Resistance, they have a random piece of a map where they're not sure how to fit in the entire galaxy. I'm sure with time and effort they might discovered which piece it is, but it's useless at face value.

 

 

To wrap this up, I thought the humor was just fine. Yeah, it's more humorous than say A New Hope or Empire Strikes Back, but it's not humor like The Phantom Menace. We don't have a Jar Jar and the jokes work. If you didn't crack up at BB-8's "thumbs up," or how Han advises Finn that women always find out the truth, you may want to consult a doctor. You could have a broken funny bone. 

 

EDIT: Oh, forgot to mention, I like Mali's theory of the identity of who...

 

Snoke is and who the Knights of Ren might be. In Rebels, we do have Inquisitors. The two current ones did have a line that implies there's quite a fair number of them. I believe one was the "fifth sister" and the other was a "seventh son." Might mean one is #5 and the other is #7, or there are multiple of one gender.

 

Edited December 25, 2015 by Atomsk88

[TheMightyEthan]

Humor:

Han's comment about women always finding out was great, and I was fine with stuff like "and I'll leave my gun", it was the more OTT stuff (usually Fin) that bothered me. Not that I didn't like Fin, but I could have done with a reduction in silliness. Like when Han was trying to tell him to turn around with his chin motion and he was like "what's this, why you keep doing this?", it was just dumb. Although like I said I probably wouldn't have minded as much if half the theater hadn't cracked the fuck up at every single little thing.

[CorgiShinobi]

Eh, I guess I can see where you're coming from. I didn't have the audience react that drastically.

 

 

I didn't think Finn was acting too bad. I mean, I thought he was being a puss, but he was trying to get away from the horrors of being a soldier of the First Order. In a way, I see it as him finally overcoming that fear and having confidence.

 

 

Oh, also forgot to give my theory for Kylo Ren's motive/reason.

 

Ben had a fear that he wouldn't live up to his legacy. Possibly during his training, he might not have been performing as one might expect of the Skywalker line. Snoke saw this opportunity and told Ben of the Dark Side and played up the legacy of Darth Vader, not Anakin Skywalker. If he chose the Dark Side, he would be more powerful than any Jedi. Of course, he still has anxiety, now about living up to Vader.

 

Edited December 25, 2015 by Atomsk88

[Mister Jack]

I like that Kylo Ren theory.  It would explain a lot.

[TheMightyEthan]

I didn't have an issue with Finn running away from the First Order, nor with the character overall, literally my only problem with him was a few of the comic relief bits. It's a JJ Abrams thing though, cause Star Trek was exactly the same.

[TheMightyEthan]

So I can now confirm that it is aided by a second viewing (or at least by not having a theater full of annoying people).

 

 

Map: alright, BB-8's map is definitely a huge chunk of the galaxy showing dozens of systems, and R2's is definitely the whole galaxy. However, it's also definitely not to scale, based on planetary orbits being halfway to the next star over, etc. Since it's not to scale in that way that could also mean the spatial relationships shown aren't accurate either, and explain why they're not able to figure out where it is until they have more context from R2's part.

 

Mask: I still think it would have been better if he hadn't taken off his mask his mask until the bridge scene. The interrogation scene would suffer slightly by him keeping his mask on, but I feel like the benefit to the bridge scene would outweigh that.

 

The lightsaber stuff didn't bother me this time either, although I do think it would have been better if Rey had only been able to fight him to a draw rather than actually winning.

 

Somehow the first time I didn't even think about how random it is that R2 just wakes up for no apparent reason, but this time it really struck me as contrived.

 

But overall none of the things I was complaining about before really detracted from it this time.

 

[CorgiShinobi]

I could go either way.

 

I mean, the benefit of Kylo/Ben taking off his mask in the interrogation is you see the shift of control. Kylo's pride slowly changing to frustration and then fear as this girl begins peering into his mind and sees his fear. If he kept the mask on, it would be kinda goofy if Kylo had been struggling too much while you just see an emotionless mask jerking around. It would work if really he's only reaching out still, but Rey is clearly rising and starring harder at him.

 

 

Speaking of, one other thing I forgot to mention in my gripes! It's about the very end:

 

Anyone else think the final scenes of Rey and Luke Skywalker went on a little too long? Like, she extends her arm out with his lightsaber in hand and they have a starring contest 15 feet apart. I joked with my father that Luke might have forgotten his daughter's name.

 

[TheRevanchist]

I have no gripes. I was expecting another shitstorm like Ep I,II. This really brings things back to a quality SW story. I'm going to see it again this weekend.

[TheMightyEthan]

I agree about the final scene going on too long, but it's the kind of mildly awkward thing that can show up in any movie so I didn't find it worth complaining about.

[Baconrath]

Back in my day instead of [REDACTED] we had

Sun Crushers.

Edited December 27, 2015 by TheMightyEthan
Added spoiler tag

[TheMightyEthan]

^ Not technically a spoiler, but enough to allow someone to infer some spoilers.

[Hot Heart]

 

 

Firstly, doesn't R2 wake up only when Rey arrives at the rebel base? That's what everyone around the internet has already been saying, and it seems the right "coincidence".

 

Just to clarify on the Mary Sue thing, it's not just that Rey's so good at nearly everything, the original inspiration is that an author-insert gets to join an existing universe and interact with all the famous characters and be liked and cool. So, for example, you'd fly the Millenium Falcon and meet Han Solo and Chewbacca and get a lightsaber and win a battle with a Sith.

 

Obviously, introducing new characters in among the existing will make it look like that, so I don't really have a problem anyway.

 

What I will say, having rewatched the originals over Christmas is that I love what they've done with Kylo Ren. The fact that he's not fully formed is great, but also if you compare it to RotJ, there are these really interesting shades. All along, Luke is holding onto that glimmer of light in his father and is trying constantly to bring him back; even throwing his lightsaber aside when he's bested him and everything seems hopeless. Rey just wants to kill the "monster", which will only drive him further towards the dark side.

 

[TheMightyEthan]

If that was the "coincidence" then you're right, it makes sense, but they should have done something to encourage us to draw that connection (not saying they needed to spell it out, but I saw it twice and that never even occurred to me).

[Hot Heart]

 

Well, JJ Abrams is all about "mystery box" stuff so I figure it's the case of wanting the connection to be spotted by those who look hard enough and "provable" in hindsight, but not obvious at a casual glance.

 

[Mister Jack]

[deanb]

I knew there was something I wanted to post:

https://i.imgur.com/FsbWstp.gifv

 

 

http://www.howbb8works.com/

[Mister Jack]

Dean, come on, I JUST explained how BB-8 works.

[deanb]

http://i.imgur.com/1uREAJm.gifv

 

Well explain this one then.

[TheMightyEthan]

What's that game called again?

[TCP]

Just saw the movie again, second time.

Knowing to keep an ear out for Yoda, old-Obi and young Obi's voices in the Rey's vision made it really easy to hear everything. Noticed a few other things like the person holding Rey back in her vision where she's watching the ship blast off is the alien played by Simon Pegg whom she trades with. Also noticed the bit where Rey was wearing Poe/Finn's jacket, and then when Finn and Rey walk onto the balcony to witness Han and Ben's interaction, Finn is clearly adjusting the jacket like he just put it back on, nice tough. I had a lot more appreciation for the fight between Rey and Kylo now that I wasn't in complete shock over Han's death.

After seeing the movie the first time I thought the interaction between Rey and Leia was more, but it wasn't till the end so I guess there's no reason Rey couldn't have been Luke's daughter. Maz asks Han who she is, the scene cuts away, and next time we see Maz she's trying to give the light sabre to Rey, so he could have said "I think she might be Luke's daughter" or something. Plus Han already filled Leia in on Rey, offscreen by the time Fin talks to her. So we never actually see how Han explains Rey to anyone in the movie. Not to mention Han gives Rey some looks throughout the movie, and treated her kind of how an uncle might treat his niece. Then at the end, Leia and her hug, seemingly knowing who each other are after Han dies, though that could be force businesses, but could also be a sister recognizing her brother's child and Rey instinctually recognizing a family member similar how she managed to pick up the force. I mean, you'd think Han would have said something but this is also the series where neither Obi-Wan or Yoda mentioned to Luke that Leia was his sister, when Luke and Leia were definitely in a situation that could have lead to banging, of the most incestual manner, so in that sense, it's not THAT bad. Rey clearly has some memory tampering going on, since when she flies the Falcon and gets past the two Tie Fighters on Jakku, her and Fin celebrate and underneath both of them talking Rey says she doesn't know how she did any of the flying. TELL US J.J.!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[danielpholt]

What's that game called again?

 

That would be Besiege.