The Division

[Hot Heart]

I'd like to be able to kill everyone.

 

...wait, what thread is this?

[deanb]

I'm just hugely bummed it's an MMO.

[TheMightyEthan]

From what I've gathered that's an oversimplification at best.  It seems like an MMO in the same way that Destiny is, which is not really.

[deanb]

Well until there's a broader range of words use in the industry, the oversimplification by calling it "MMO" will have to do. It ain't co-op MP and given the persistent nature I'd guess it's not completive MP either. PvP and PvE are MMO terms, and there's a comparison to Guild Wars, which is an MMO. Dice rolls is another MMO thing since it's easier than doing the physics in real time in an MMO server.

 

Obviously it's not WoW, but it ain't no CoD or Borderlands either.

[TheMightyEthan]

Just because we don't have another term yet doesn't mean we have to cram it in to existing terms. We are capable of coming up with terms.

 

Granted I know a lot less about this than Destiny, but both this game and that seem like something I would describe as shared-world campaign co-op/singleplayer.

 

And what dice rolls are you referring to? Honest question, like I said I don't know much about this game. But dice rolls are common in singleplayer RPGs too.

[deanb]

The dice rolls mentioned in Alex's link. And sure they are in many RPGs, but this a shooter, which as they note in most online shooter games it tends to be physics/trajectories/all that lot. I think Fallout is one of the few SP shooters with dice rolls.

 

And "persistent shared world co-op" is pretty much an alternative description of "massively multiplayer on-line game".

 

As far as destiny goes, that seems to be an MMO as well, but just like yourself, not using the word "MMO". I imagine due to stigma.

[TheMightyEthan]

Well for one thing, at least with Destiny, it's not one big world that everyone's in. You're never going to see hundreds of players running around in the city, it's matchmade on the fly, more like how Journey worked. So while it's online you're only ever in the same game space as a few other people at a time. Also, you can play offline if you want. I had gotten the impression the Division worked the same way, but I could be wrong.

[Mr. GOH!]

I suspect that both this and Destiny will me hugely MP-focused, more so than MMOs. I think you will be able to solo in both, but neither will feel like an SP game. I'm sure it will feel akin to playing a multiplayer match against bots.

[TheMightyEthan]

That might be true about this, but I really don't think it will be with Destiny.  Based on everything I've read it will have a campaign comparable to something like Halo, with a full on campaign and specially designed encounters, etc.

[Mr. GOH!]

Specially designed for co-op, sure.

[TheMightyEthan]

They say it'll scale from one to three players (the max for the campaign), and based on the Halo games I have no reason to doubt them.  And as with a traditional FPS, competitive multi is an entirely separate mode.

 

You could be entirely right about the Division though, I know almost nothing about it beyond what was in that first trailer and Alex's link.

[Mr. GOH!]

The developers have stated that The Division was built for multiplayer from the ground up. 

 

Re: Destiny: http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/12/16/will-you-be-able-to-play-all-of-destiny-on-your-own

 

This makes it sound like that you can play SP, but that they will be doing their damnedest to make sure a bunch of the game will require teaming.

 

 

“I would say that there’s some sort of – if you wanted to talk about it in MMO terms, you’d say ‘end-game activities’, but some of the most intense non-competitive activities in the game do require cooperation. They require a group of players to tackle at once."

Raids, for example, will require additional players, but you will indeed be able to complete the campaign solo if you so choose.

“I guess at some variable, distant endpoint we are going to say, ‘Yeah, if you show up at this door, and you don’t have five friends, you’re not going to be able to succeed,’ but the core experience that solo players have enjoyed in shooters, they’re going to be able to get that, and we’re going to pull many of them into social experiences as well.”

[TheMightyEthan]

That's talking about endgame raid type things though, at the bottom he says the core solo campaign that people expect is still there. My understanding is the raids are their replacement for firefight in this game, PvE but not actually part of the campaign.

[Mr. GOH!]

Fair enough, We'll see, either way. This is a The Division thread, so we should move the Destiny discussion to its thread. 

 

My bottom line on both The Division and Destiny MP: that the developers/publishers chose to make games always-online and connected to other players suggests that SP is far from the focus and any language coming from them that plays *can* play SP is likely just positive messaging for marketing purposes and should be taken with a grain of salt. They did not invest the time and money into a robust online infrastructure so that folks could play a SP game.  

[deanb]

 

50 minute video if you want that. Seem they're ramping up media for this game, I guess it's due out this year after a massively long hiatus.

 

Housemate has given a spin with it (part developed by Reflections which are in town) and seems to like it. Though he picked up Mad Max when MGSV came out so his opinion of games is maybe moot.

[TheMightyEthan]

I preordered it so I could get in to the beta, then cancelled my preordered once I had the beta code.

[Hot Heart]

I'm sort of interested in this, but it looks like it's "three-man fireteams" again, which is the problem with most of Destiny's content. I've tried finding some clarification, but can't see if there is anything about allowing four-man teams.

[deanb]

http://i.imgur.com/SAkFHHd.gifv

 

I've grabbed this on uPlay for the weekend open beta if anyone wants to join. I've only got Ethan on there at the moment, though as discovered in the PSN thread you should be able to add both of us pretty easily

[MetalCaveman]

Played for a bit, weird to play a Tom Clancy game were enemies just have numbers popping out of them every time I shoot them, usually they go down in 1-2 hits.

[danielpholt]

Couldn't play the Beta yesterday as it went live after I went to be in the afternoon (Nightshift worker), so I figured I'd jump on this morning after work. Nope. Server Maintenance at 9am until midday meaning that once again, I won't be able to play the damned thing.

 

Plus side, I think Ubisoft just saved me £45. Yay?

[danielpholt]

Been playing for roughly an hour now and good god am I bored. I'll jump on again after work tomorrow, but initial first impressions are kind of meh. Everything looks..............nice from a technical perspective, the world is kind of bland though (although I guess that's the issue with this setting). Shooting feels fine, a touch bullet-spongey but whatever. 

 

Glad I didn't pre-order this. If anything it's making me want to jump back into that Bungie game once again. 

[TheMightyEthan]

Yeah, those were pretty much my thoughts. Destiny can be fun solo because the combat is inherently fun, but the only way I'd play The Division is if I had a consistent group of people who I wanted to play with.

[deanb]

I played it a bit this morning, bit bummed to find there's only the two core missions in there and the rest is just the PvP and the mini-side-mission stuff (let's call them...Patrols)

 

Yeah it looks rather pretty (see above video) but yeah, pretty damn bland with it's "shooty gun" "shooty harder gun" "reloady faster gun". Gunplay feels a bit pants too, not very exciting, just the same series over n over. I guess, since Destiny is the main comparison for this, that has the bonus of a sci-fi setting so you can have invisible enemies, elemental weaponry, special skills etc. This the enemies are also bullet sponge, and more bullet sponge for the bosses.

[Hot Heart]

Played it for a couple of hours yesterday and that's pretty much my thoughts too. I think it's cool to "go out into the wild and forage" and build a better base, etc. but nothing's really gelling for me. Constant in and out of menus to upgrade stability by 2.50% or put on some gloves that have the same armour value but make the + go up 2 green chevrons, waiting for a "pulse" charge so I can tell whether the guys halfway down the street are bad when they can spot me half a mile a way anyway.

 

And the shooting isn't even that fun. The cover thing sounded cool, but I don't feel as free or mobile as in Gears of War, or that flanking is even worthwhile or rewarding. I don't even know who I'm shooting and people keep barking things at me through my controller.

 

I get that it's an RPG first, shooter second so I guess I just prefer Destiny as a shooter first, RPG second.

 

That said, I gave a citizen in need a medkit and they gave me a beanie. Well, they dropped it on the ground. Ungrateful bastard.

[Mister Jack]

I got the exact opposite impression from this game.  I hated Destiny, but Division seems to have a much better idea of how to handle missions, PVP, and an open world.  The shooting is good enough, I suppose, but the cover system is pretty smooth once you get used to it.  I'm not buying it at launch, though.  I'm going to wait a bit and see what people have to say about it after a month has passed.  I learned my lesson last time.