excel_excel Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Just to take the heat off Thursday a bit: http://forums.eidosg...ad.php?t=119397 What the fuck do they think this is? A console? Interesting is the mod replies. Q: I bought a RETAIL copy IN UK but I live OUTSIDE UK. Will I be able to ACTIVATE the game or not? A: No. Can only activate the UK boxed copy in UK (includes Isle of man etc) Quote: Q: If I buy a boxed UK copy and activate it in the UK, will I be able to play it in other regions? A: That's a most definitive yes. Couldn't a person technically do that faking IP thing for this pretend there in the UK, activate it, then play it? It does use Steamworks doesn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 I've never understood the whys of region locking in general. Could someone please explain this in a way that makes sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thursday Next Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 If they're locking the activation region, then there's really only one reason for it and it's a pretty shitty one. It's a way to get around EU Article 101. The following shall be prohibited as incompatible with the internal market: all agreements between undertakings, decisions by associations of undertakings and concerted practices which may affect trade between Member States and which have as their object or effect the prevention, restriction or distortion of competition within the internal market, and in particular those which: (a) directly or indirectly fix purchase or selling prices or any other trading conditions; If country X is selling the game for more than country Y then it is cheaper for people in country X to import from country Y so profit margins for the publisher decrease. Especially if country X is an emerging market where not many other publishers are selling games and competition is not so fierce, a publisher in this country would effectively have a monopoly and would seek to exploit that. EU laws prohibit restricting trade between EU states, German shoppers must be allowed to shop in Italy, Italians in France and so on. The only "good" reason for region locking is for online multiplayer titles where you want to ensure that for example an Australian doesn't hop onto an EU server and screw the match with their ridiculously high ping. Otherwise, it's to keep people who have to pay lots for games from going somewhere cheap to buy them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Thanks for the explanation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterDex Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 @Johnny, Nobody is being harmed by the used game sales though. The only thing that has happened is that technology now allows them to banish or diminish used game sales and they reap greater profits. I don't know if you can say nobody is harmed. The used market these days is different to how it was a few years ago. Gamestop undercuts publishers and developers on Day 2. When console games rely so much on front-loaded sales, they're losing profits to Gamestop and when the figures come in, those lost profits could make the difference between a greenlit sequel or an IP locked away in limbo. How do Gamestop's practices differ now from those a few years ago? I don't know about anywhere else other than my own region but before Gamestop came in, used games weren't available for sale on Day 2. It would usually be a month or two after release before you'd come across a second-hand game. When Gamestop came, they started undercutting the devs and publishers on day 2 by 10% and that's where they made so much money. They were the first that I saw that aggressively encourage trade-ins and used sales - offering more for trade-ins of brand new games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thursday Next Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 I don't know about anywhere else other than my own region but before Gamestop came in, used games weren't available for sale on Day 2. It would usually be a month or two after release before you'd come across a second-hand game. When Gamestop came, they started undercutting the devs and publishers on day 2 by 10% and that's where they made so much money. They were the first that I saw that aggressively encourage trade-ins and used sales - offering more for trade-ins of brand new games. I think it took until the advent of CD/DVD based games before pre-owned really took off. Cartridge games always (or at least nearly always) had something of the previous owner on them, a save file, high score, what have you. You factor in that, and the growing games market and people just plain getting used to the idea of trading in games (thanks to GameStop's encouragement) and I think it was something of a perfect storm that saw pre-owned swell from the tiny rear corner of the shop to the huge centrepiece. I think we're getting to that point with Digital downloads now. It's just the publishers foolish and stubborn stance of not undercutting retail prices that is stopping digital from becoming more dominant more quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deanb Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Digital accounts for like 40% of games purchases now. tbh that seems surprisingly high to me. I'd be somewhat wary of download only on consoles. ATM I have like 5 PSN games of which 2 are from the downtime. PC has stood the test of time, but consoles come and go like a fart in the wind. And at least if a PC DD service goes down I still have many ways to get the games back . So I'm all for discs on consoles until I can have some assurances that I'm not just making a very very expensive rental. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Well, the other big difference with games now is the nature of them. With old games like Contra you'd go back and play them over and over. Now games are a 20-40 hour process and it's extremely rare that people go back and replay their old games. Additionally there are so many new games out that you're even less likely to replay an old one. Couple that with the fact that you're going to get a new COD and Halo every single year then you never need to keep your old one. All of these things impact why people whom I know trade in their old games. They all also have nothing to do with gamestop. Also, the used copies that gamestop sells on day 2 are usually just played by employees. Gamestop still probably paid full price to the publisher for those. There are no used copies of a game that were never sold as new to begin with unless gamestop ate that $5 themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faiblesse Des Sens Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Now games are a 20-40 hour process ...wait, what? RPGs are that long... but RPGs have always been long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Red Dead Redemption, LA Noire, Mass Effect. All come to mind. Shooters take closer to 10 hours but that's still considerably longer than the 45 minutes it took to finish Contra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr W Phallus Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Red Dead Redemption, LA Noire, Mass Effect. All come to mind. Shooters take closer to 10 hours but that's still considerably longer than the 45 minutes it took to finish Contra. Two games by one unique studio and an RPG... that's not exactly strong evidence. :/ I'm no expert on retro games, but I'm fairly confident saying that 45 minutes in not an accurate approximation of how long it took most people to complete Contra for the first time. Whilst single player games are getting longer in one sense, the difficulty is getting so much easier that this effectively gets cancelled out. I get what you're saying about people not replaying games, I usually have to wait a long time before I can play a games campaign again (I still keep nearly every game I buy though) but this differs so much from person to person, my friend started a new game on AC:Brotherhood days after completing it and he's not even a big gamer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Yeah, everyone is different. I just know that in the circles I run in (middle aged family men) it's rare to get enough time to play the games you have let alone replay games you've already beat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 So, another thought has occurred to me. Libraries. They loan out books but also Music CD's, Movies, and Audiobooks on CD. Why aren't any publishers screaming and yelling about all the lost revenue they get from the local libraries? Surely these places are costing them BILLIONS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thursday Next Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 I think Libraries get a free pass for being "a good thing". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 I think Libraries get a free pass for being "a good thing". But they're just as bad as those evil PIRATES! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr W Phallus Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 The library analogy is a good one - and one, I think, that highlights just how ridiculous it is that the video-game industry is currently making such a big deal about the issue. It's not just the publishers who act like a problem which every other industry involving the sale of non-consumable goods faces (and manages to overcome) is some sort of immoral, financially ruinous tragedy, but also the customers who complain that benefits for first-hand buyers, which are equally prevalent in other industries, are themselves an immoral affront to their rights as a customer because for whatever reason they believe they are entitled to more for less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deanb Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 Libraries do games too.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 Yep, where's the outrage eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 (edited) Libraries are a fictional place, that's why. Besides, they're all work and no play (in this age of non book readers, then again not really) so... they don't come to mind when you think video games. Well, I think the volume of people going in libraries to get those stuff are so small, they're irreverent in figuring out how much money you could lose from just plain borrowing. (All this talk about libraries makes me want to go visit one that's 5 minute walk from my house...) Edited August 19, 2011 by MaliciousH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 (edited) I'm actually surprised by just how many people actively use libraries, at least around here. I mean, each little city in the Metroplex I live in has 2-3 branches for their library. Edited August 19, 2011 by Yantelope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 An interesting read on first sale doctrine attacks: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/08/poking-more-holes-first-sale-doctrine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr W Phallus Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 Surely it should matter not where it was manufactured but where it was copyrighted? I don't even understand why they would introduce an exception for non-domestically manufactured goods in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yantelope Posted August 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 Yeah, my head is spinning a bit on that one. The whole problem is made worse by the fact that text books are an artificially created demand in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P4: Gritty Reboot Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 Textbooks aren't artificial demand in themselves; it's the "updated edition!" they put out every year and require students to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr W Phallus Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 It's always interesting when the author of a 'required text' is also a lecturer on your course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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