Batman Arkham Blank

[Thursday Next]

I liked the way they handled the Riddler in AA. It was a cool alternative to beating the snot out of folks, a sort of Boss Battle - of wits!

[Faiblesse Des Sens]

I liked the way they handled the Riddler in AA. It was a cool alternative to beating the snot out of folks, a sort of Boss Battle - of wits!

 

That was probably my favorite part of the game TBQH. I loved all of the aspects where you weren't fighting.

[Hot Heart]

The whole Arkham City thing is a bit weird but it's the fact that Quincy Sharp is now the mayor and setup the place that is the weirdest. I mean, if you get all the collectibles in AA, you know he's gone a bit nuts, but I'm guessing that's not considered canon...

 

I would've loved to have seen something like No Man's Land done in videogame form (not that this isn't close).

Edited March 17, 2011 by Hot Heart

[Mr W Phallus]

I think the fact that he's nuts is the whole point, you'd have to be crazy to think Arkham City is a good idea. I don't think anyone actually knows he's crazy though, I doubt the idea of a 'ghost' telling the Warden's Mayor's backstory is canon. Is he Mayor of just Arkham City or the entirety of Gotham, though? I'm a little confused about that.

[Hot Heart]

Apparently he took credit for stopping The Joker in AA (even though the final battle was televised) and has become Mayor of Gotham off of that.

 

You'd think if Batman knew Sharp was crazy he'd have done something about it. And it's not just a ghost telling the backstory. If I remember correctly, once you find all the Spirit of Arkham stuff you can return to the warden's office and find him gone and loads of crazy scribblings (I think only visible in detective mode?). There's also an easter egg with the plans for Arkham City hidden away; but that's an easter egg so would be even less canon than collectibles.

 

If Paul Dini's still writing it, I have faith it will at least be OK.

Edited March 17, 2011 by Hot Heart

[Mr W Phallus]

To be honest, although the story is a bit contrived, it's still something I can accept without breaking the suspension of disbelief. I do think Rocksteady will have to drastically rethink the formula of the next game, however, preferably dropping the Arkham X/one long night structure (even though that was partly what was so great about AA).

 

Completely unrelated to that, I really want to be able to explore the Batcave and Wayne Manor so I hope that's in one of the games soon, even if it's just as a Tomb Raider mansion style collectible/easter-egg fest apart from the actual story-mode.

[HotChops]

I think some of you are forgetting the practical limitations set on designing a game as opposed to a Batman movie. Batman AA takes place where it does because it creates an enclosed setting and it provides an excuse to include numerous bat-villains.

 

I certainly recall thinking when AA first came out that my ideal Batman game involved the character operating within Gotham; silently monitoring the city from the ledge of a building and then dramatically dropping down from above on bad guys.

 

Rocksteady apparently feels the same way, so they created a game that harnesses that quintessential Batman experience while still conforming to the boundaries of a game. So instead of exploring all of Gotham, you'll explore one old section of it. Note that this section will include a lot of historic sites, such as Crime Alley and the Monarch Theater.

 

Contrary to what some are assuming, Rocksteady claims that this game still has a strong linear element to it. There are still plenty of indoor areas. I think this was basically their way of increasing the replay value. For example, one of my favorite things to do in AA was beat up thugs, but within the story, not the challenge mode. Arkham City will likely provide that for me. Unlike AA where there was a set number of enemies, AA will be filled with opportunities for me to drop in from ledges and take on large groups of enemies.

[WTF]

Actually HC, No Man's Land is probably the only tenable one for a game environment. Since it pretty much shuts down Gotham and isolates it from the rest of the world. I think that's why HH really really wants them to use that. However that still requires you to map all of Gotham and that's huge. It's pretty much on par with creating a world that's as big as say Morrowind. It is possible in game as can be seen in things like Stalker, but it's a game that would take about 5 years to make at the least since Gotham has been heavily described through fiction, so there will be a lot of details to add.

 

It does provide exactly that enclosed setting that you talked about since that's when the whole place is in crisis.

However, and this is major. You really cannot do that story for at least a few years since the whole plot point was that there was a massive earthquake that pretty much separated Gotham from the world. Now would be the worst time to start working on such a game on an iconic character. Maybe in the future though.

Edited March 17, 2011 by WTF

[Hot Heart]

Yeah, Arkham City is pretty close to No Man's Land in a way (and I agree, you couldn't do that sort of topic right now). I'm certainly looking forward to it. I'm getting a sort of Assassin's Creed vibe of off it; only with far better combat and a greater emphasis on being stealthy.

 

For No Man's Land, I don't think you'd necessarily have to create a big 'Gotham sandbox' nor make it as non-linear as you might expect. You could create certain areas for the game to take place in and use hubs/safehouses to select them from.

 

I just think some of the concept of retaking and rebuilding the area seen in the comics would have been nice (and something I hoped inFamous would have done more of). It's probably a tough concept to get across without being clunky though.

Edited March 17, 2011 by Hot Heart

[TheMightyEthan]

So, I have a question about No Man's Land (just read the plot summary on Wikipedia):

 

Why does an earthquake make the government decide to quarantine Gotham? That part isn't made very clear. It just says

 

Gotham City had suffered the results of a magnitude 7.6 earthquake in the earlier Cataclysm storyline. In response, the U.S government declared Gotham a "no man's land," destroyed all bridges leading to Gotham and forbade people from entering or exiting.

Seems like there's a gap in the reasoning there.

[HotChops]

So, I have a question about No Man's Land (just read the plot summary on Wikipedia):

 

Why does an earthquake make the government decide to quarantine Gotham? That part isn't made very clear. It just says

 

Gotham City had suffered the results of a magnitude 7.6 earthquake in the earlier Cataclysm storyline. In response, the U.S government declared Gotham a "no man's land," destroyed all bridges leading to Gotham and forbade people from entering or exiting.

Seems like there's a gap in the reasoning there.

 

Actually, it sounds a lot like what the government of Louisiana did after Hurricane Katrina. In that case, they did it because New Orleans had become so lawless that they decided to cut off the major access points.

 

edit: I wonder if No Man's Land was written after Katrina...

 

edit2: nope.

Edited March 17, 2011 by HotChops

[Hot Heart]

I seem to recall there was some sort of political reasoning in that Gotham had been a blight on the nation and now seemed the perfect opportunity to treat them as a completely separate entity and section it off.

 

Adds to the fact that Bruce Wayne (well, Batman) feels he needs to seize control and establish peace.

 

I'd recommend reading the collection.

Edited March 17, 2011 by Hot Heart

[WTF]

About No Man's Land. Some background in 90s comics might be necessary. This was post Bat-Azrael and I think somewhere right after Superman's resurrection or was it when he was dead (that part I'm not clear). Anyways it was when Lex Luthor was president of the USA. Now well when you have Lex as the president and you have Bruce Wayne as Batman that's not really going to work. There were lots of points when Batman pretty much had to go against the US government since Lex was prez.

So they created this whole crossover following apocalypse which pretty much separated Gotham from the rest of the US and Batman along with GCPD and the others pretty much tried to bring order to the now chaotic Gotham. If I recall correctly there were lots of supers against it but then again since Gotham was almost independant it made sense.

This type of storyline was later explored in both 52 (Black adam and his rule over that country whose name I forget) and in Marvel when the Green Goblin became in a high position of power post Secret Invasion.

[Connorrrr]

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/03/16/riddler-takes-on-bigger-role-specifically-jigsaws-role-in-bat/

 

Riddler has a proper role this time around. Sounds kinda cool. I actually kinda missed some of his stuff last time.

 

I went through getting all the Riddler stuff. I think the riddler could be an awesome villian in Rocksteady's hand so I'm glad they're giving him a bigger role.

[CorgiShinobi]

So, yeah, how about that Black Mask in Arkham City?

[WTF]

I think we could see Jason Todd's Red Hood more likely in the game in some form or the other.

 

I think firstly we need to realise that this game is an extension of the 90s DCAU. If it's DCAU Batman, it follows from the 90s comics, and to some extent the Justice League show of the early 2000s. The continuation via JLU might not really fit. So this is entirely out of current comic continuity, pre-crisis, post-infinite crisis and 52 and post final crisis. So a lot of characters, storylines and stuff will not be present.

 

DCAU exists sort of like a different reality of the multiverse. However not all the of the animated films and shows exist within the same universe. Some stories can co-exist, but not all. So we are more likely to see what DC or WB wants people to see relevant as a character or scenario in today's comics. It will be Dini'sand Timm's DCAU.

 

Characters we are likely to see definitely include Gotham City Sirens (Dini loves them) such as Poison Ivy, Harlequin, Oracle, current Batgirl (Stephanie Brown as opposed to Cassandra Cain) Huntress, Catwoman, Zatanna, etc. Amongst the male characters since Nightwing is now Batman in present continuity, they'll avoid showing Dick Grayson. We are likely to see Tim Drake as Robin possibly. Damien Wayne wouldn't exist in this continuity without another introduction and it would seem pointless to introduce him though his mother Talia is in the game. Since there's a gap between Grayson and Drake and Todd was seen as Red Hood we could see him acting as an anti-hero/psychopath in this lawless city. Fits with his MO and would fit with Strange's taunts too.

 

Mr Freeze obviously is in voiced by Maurice LaMarche.

Jack Ryder aka the creeper is already in the game and depending on when it's set we could see the creeper or we'll just see the douchebag side as Jack Ryder.

We've also been told Calendar man is in though not to how far he's in the game.

However to keep the story in focus we will obviously not see all of them. Oracle as always will be on intercom. We already know about Harlequin and Catwoman's presence. The villain is Strange and new character Sharpe along with Joker and a side trap of Riddler (who's still not tried to go good in DCAU as opposed to the comics). They've mentioned Two-Face being in the game. I could see Zatanna make a small appearance possibly if Dini wants to interest people in his current ongoing.

 

We could see some of the inmates from the first game like Bane or Croc returning though they are better villains in a game sense in a more closed environment. We could see a few of the gangsters though not all since it wouldn't make total sense.

[Hot Heart]

Atomsk was referring to what Greg Miller at IGN spotted in the latest trailer. Seems more likely than the Red Hood.

 

And they haven't just mentioned Two-Face. He's been known and now shown for a long time.

[WTF]

Ah if it's Black Mask and Talia then it's quite likely they're bringing in Todd.

I mean we have Black Mask, we have Mr Freeze and we have Talia. The connection is there. Of course he need not make an appearance but could be like how Freeze was in the first game.

[Hot Heart]

Yeah, I get the feeling there will be lots of nods to the Batman lore (IGN saw the Sionis Industries signs as well as ones for The Penguin and one for The Flying Graysons) if Rocksteady aren't putting the actual villains in the game.

 

Ultimately, if they don't work, I'm guessing gameplay trumps what Dini wants to write (which might be an interesting topic to look at in terms of game development).

Edited March 18, 2011 by Hot Heart

[TheMightyEthan]

Man, I am so out of touch with the Batman lore...

[Hot Heart]

Sorry, Ethan, you can only specialise in one: law or lore.

[TheMightyEthan]

I thought "lore" was just British for "law"?

[WTF]

Yeah, I get the feeling there will be lots of nods to the Batman lore (IGN saw the Sionis Industries signs as well as ones for The Penguin and one for The Flying Graysons) if Rocksteady aren't putting the actual villains in the game.

 

Ultimately, if they don't work, I'm guessing gameplay trumps what Dini wants to write (which might be an interesting topic to look at in terms of game development).

 

Who knows really. We've not seen a lot of the game to judge. I recall people seeing Batman:AA and thinking this will be a 6 or 7 rated game. In fact I personally had doubts when my friend who worked at Rocksteady showed me some footage in April of that year. But it completely surprised most people when it came out. I hope this time too the surprise is positive.

[excaliburps]

I'm setting an appointment with Rocksteady and if things go according to plan, you guys have any Arkham City questions?

 

So excited for this game. I mean this and Uncharted 3 might be my game of the year now that Last Guardian and Mass Effect 3 have been moved to next year.

 

So, anything you want to ask 'em? =)

[TheMightyEthan]

I have a question: will it be less linear than Arkham Asylum? The structure of the world in AA made me feel like I should be choosing between which missions I want to do at any given time, but in actuality it was very linear.