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Ok, you didn't know how many rooms the normandy had in ME2 until after you bought the game so it's not like you were tricked into buying it because you thought there were 12 party members when there were only 10 on the disc. You said that if you see something on the box (like a car spoiler) then you expect it in the game. I agree. But this extra content wasn't on the box so I don't see what your issue is. Doors or no doors you would know there are two characters that you don't have, so what's the big deal? I always thought Triple Plays were more expensive by a few quid. If you say they aren't I'll take your word for it. I've tried to explain that I've a conflict of interest in the matter. Yes, you can call it hypocritical if you like, but in both scenarios I am anti resellers whether it's because the publisher side of me wants more new purchases or the consumer side of me hates getting ripped off by the reseller. Oh incidentally, none of this should be taken as the opinion of my employer. When I comment here I do so as a private individual not a representative of a business. EDIT: Oh and with regard to the cost to EA for a new person, I conceded that point to Yante. Didn't see the need to do it again. Yes, the cost to the publisher may be lower or higher depending on use of the service. I don't know where it would all end I certainly don't think that any publisher would push the cost of an online pass higher than the wholesale price of the product, but maybe they would?

Paper, thermometer, cooking utensils and some "boring" stuff. You crazy man!

Zaeed wasn't "at a later date" it came out the same time as the launch of the rest of the game. Dragon Age has done the same too. The content was all ready n tied up for launch but instead of being in the game it was up as DLC. Oh and we're left moaning that there's a couple of rooms in the Normandy obviously added in to accommodate 2 party members, yet you can get to the end of the game and they're not filled in. I'd be a bit miffed if I bought a lego car and the picture had a spoiler on but there was none in my box. Was Zaeed on the ME2 box? If not, why would you expect him to be included? As explained before, DLC is a separate product, with a separate budget. It's not "cut" from the main game. No one seems to have an issue with "extended editions" of movies. It's the same principal here. Well once again we come across the bit of maths up top. If the used market was to stop does that mean that EA would no longer be able to afford to support these games with patches and multiplayer since the only income they have is the initial new purchase? Also Blu-Ray have online components btw (and most give you 3 versions of the film lately aswell). You have to pay quite a bit more for those triple play versions. Also, I've never seen an "online" component on blu-ray that does anything beyond direct me to a website. Because that would be easy to sort out. And a 5-10 year limit in gaming means this used sale charge spanning entire generations and in some cases out living the life of studios. And how would these fees be collected and distributed? That was a hypothetical, tongue in cheek comment. Let's get things in perspective here. I work for a publisher. I don't like that when Gamestop post profits that a large chunk of that is from selling games two or more times when I know that my company and others that actually make the content don't see any return on that. I want everyone to play my publishers games and I want them to do so by pre-ordering the stupid, exclusive, premium, uber, [studio Name], special, collectors edition. Buying it new, on day one, and purchasing every single saddle, hat, and map pack we offer up. I want this because it directly impacts my financial situation. On the other hand, I'm a consumer, when I buy retail games I always buy new, that said, I do also trade in my games, when I trade them in it annoys me that I'm being given £10 tops by Game, who will then put it on the shelf for at least £30 (selling them for over £20 is also the reason that I don't buy them used - Used should be half the price of new, not 10% off). I could fix this by selling games on ebay, but I'm too lazy. Finally, I quite like DLC. Most games I play take me a few weeks to complete if not longer what with work commitments and all, but if I really liked it, being able to get another couple of quests for a few quid is, to my mind, a bonus. I honestly think that ME2 and Dragon Age DLC does provide good value for money. The stories are generally well fleshed out and I like that the new characters blend in with the old ones and mesh with the story. If that bonus DLC comes in the form of a code in a box as a reward for buying new, so much the better.

Yes, I would complain. Just as I would have complained when EADM introduced fees for long-term(2 year) downloading of games. If I was a person who complained about these things, I would certainly do so. The point is that it's there. If you're trying to table a justifiable digital distribution service, you don't continue to implement elements that place you below the bar. You copy what works, and improve upon that. Increasingly draconian standards are silly, backwards things in the face of advancement. I won't assume you're a partisan just because you're arguing them, but anyone who supports the relentless wading through a growing mire of fees, needless restrictions and DLC, premeditated or not, surely is a masochist. How are these clauses any better? "Either you or Valve has the right to terminate or cancel your Account or a particular Subscription at any time." "C. Termination by Valve. 1. In the case of a recurring payment Subscription (e.g., a monthly subscription), in the event that Valve terminates or cancels your Account or a particular Subscription for convenience, Valve may, but is not obligated to, provide a prorated refund of any prepaid Subscription fees paid to Valve. 2. In the case of a one-time purchase of a product license (e.g., purchase of a single game) from Valve, Valve may choose to terminate or cancel your Subscription in its entirety or may terminate or cancel only a portion of the Subscription (e.g., access to the software via Steam) and Valve may, but is not obligated to, provide access (for a limited period of time) to the download of a stand-alone version of the software and content associated with such one-time purchase. 3. In the case of a free Subscription, Valve may choose to terminate or amend the terms of the Subscription as provided in the "Amendments to this Agreement" section above." In plain English: Valve can basically shut you down at any time and burn all your content. They can (if they want to) offer you a replacement download, but they don't have to. These clauses are everywhere and EA's are no more Draconian than Valves.

Fair points both. Where third party RSPs are the norm there is no justification for an Online Pass. However, since that only applies to PC, where used game sales are non-existent it's something of a moot point. Were consoles to have some form of RSP program so that users were directly paying for servers, Online Pass becomes harder to justify. With regard to number of simultaneous users, I agree that it does not necessarily mean an extra cost, in fact, if a 24/7 online player sold the game to a lighter gamer, then the load on and cost to EA would in fact decrease. I would still hold to the justification that the single player game and multiplayer service are separate. You sell the disc on with the single player content, but you burnt the code. Perhaps a suitable analogy for this would be selling a pay as you go phone. You can either sell the phone with minutes on it (i.e. don't use the Online Pass code) or you can use the minutes and sell the phone and leave the next guy to top it up with a tenner (or buy an online pass).

You are not seriously complaining that if you don't even log in to Origin for two years that EA "may" delete your account for non use? It's a classic CMA clause in the EULA. In most EULAs half of it is stuff that is included to cover worst case scenarios and the other half is bluff clauses that wouldn't stand up in court for longer than it took a judge to clear his throat. Really not worth the panic.

I hope you're not referring to Gran Torino. Remind me... exactly who does Clint kill?

You seem to be deliberately ignoring the fact that online gaming is a service. It requires continual investment to run, not just server space but the people to run/maintain the servers, the hardware, the software updates, all that stuff. Analogies with car parts don't really work because once a seat is in a car it costs nothing for the manufacturer to leave it in and would cost more to take it out. They do still charge you for servicing though if you go through their dealers. Getting angry because ME2 was planned to have more content added at a later date doesn't make any sense to me. Either they magically added in extra rooms to the Normandy which would have left people moaning that the layout was wrong and there were more windows inside than outside and why didn't EA think it through instead of foisting ill conceived tacked on DLC on the game or they put the rooms in during early development so that everything meshes together nicely. Do you get annoyed that your legos had bits sticking out that are obviously there so that more legos can be stuck on them? With regard to Demos/Early Access. It's not semantics. Early Access is the full game, downloaded to your console / PC in advance. There's nothing to suggest that demos won't continue to be released as before, but they will be small portions of the game, a couple of teams and limited gameplay options. There was some talk of having Season Ticket overlap with release, maybe this was dropped or maybe it's in the pipeline. I don't know. Buying music, films and so forth are not services. They are products. You don't see official forums for every album / film release filled with people asking for x or y issue to be fixed. If Maximus is wearing a Casio in Gladiator there will not be a patch to fix it or if there is it will be in a new boxed product which you will have to buy, if Jimmi Hendrix misses a chord they won't correct the error. You got the content, that's it. Game publishers are service providers. They support products, sometimes years after launch in a way that album and film makers do not as such they deserve to be paid for every copy sold, even second hand ones, because these days they are expected to continue to support products after they have been purchased irrespective of if they were purchased first hand, second hand or swapped with a mate. That said, I wouldn't have an issue if any shop (bar charity shops) that sells goods second hand had to kick a % to the original manufacturer (maybe stick a 5-10 year limit on it or something so older stuff is exempt).

One prolific poster.

1. Online gaming is not a car seat, at best it is an optional extra. Physical copies of games do in fact come with a warranty (for the disc itself not the software on it). 2. The DLC was planned for ME2 when ME2 was being developed. If the extra rooms hadn't been included then the DLC would not have meshed with the full game and would have felt "tacked on". EA did not make the game with those extras in, then have a raffle to see which characters should be removed for DLC. 3. Season ticket gives you early access to the full game, not a demo. There are lots of early access promotions out there. This service means that you can play the game while you wait for play.com or whoever to deliver it to your door. No need to go to midnight launches to get the game first. Oh and yes... EA probably does care more about the people who pay them more money, just like every other business. 4. As it is, Gamestop are the one's overcharging for second hand games. Not publishers. If Gamestop had paid a royalty to the content producers for second hand sales, content producers may not have felt the need to go direct to the second hand purchaser for some money.

In the trailers I seem to recall I saw Harrison Ford looking scared like he does when suddenly and unexpectedly outnumbered by hordes of Stormtroopers/Natives/Ants so wasn't sure if that was somewhat slapstick-esque. "Cowboys" is, for me at least a light hearted term. You play Cowboys and Injuns when you're a kid. When you grow up you watch Westerns / Spaghetti Westerns. First to admit I'm judging a film by the cover, which is why I asked if someone, preferably someone who's seen it could let me know what sort of film it is. Basically, is it more "Men In Black" or "Way of the Warrior"? or is it another beast entirely?

If you buy anything second hand you don't get the service that comes with a first purchase. Cars: No manufacturer warranty, but you can buy a warranty from the main dealer. Sky: Buy second hand box, minimum channels unless you subscribe. Phone: No calls unless you pay. Games are no different. Buy second hand and wysiwyg. Buy new or pay the extra and you get to have the full service. Portal wasn't just a Valve thing (please don't make the mistake of thinking they are some benevolent altruistic NPO, they're out to make money too), first purchasers of Alice MR got Alice free. Second hand have to pay for it. EA also did "buy Dead Space 2 LE (which iirc cost no more than the standard edition) get Dead Space Extraction free". Not sure what you mean by "charging for demos" and as for "taking out" content, that simply doesn't happen. A game doesn't get made, then EA look at it and say "what can we remove from this to sell separately?" DLC is planned from the start to be a separate offering. There is a degree of customers getting caught in the crossfire, but that's on Gamestop. They know that the second hand products are worth $10 less once the code is burnt, they just haven't moved to take that into account. They've been ripping customers off for years with used sales anyway. Maybe this will finally make people realise that it's not such a great deal after all.

To be somewhat bull headed. Gamestop are the ones that should budge on this. Publishers (developers etc.) create the content and provide the service. When it comes to used game sales Gamestop pay naff all for them and then charge fractionally below the RRP for the next guy to walk in. It's free money for them, they've been creaming mega bucks off of selling the same game twice (or thrice) and don't kick anything back to the publishers. If they'd kept the publisher sweet by chipping a % of the profits their way, then publishers be much more pumped about used game sales. As it is, publishers will continue to annex the "service" part of their products and retain control over that. Gamestop will just have to adjust their pricing structure to reflect the fact that second time round they are only selling content and not service.

Feelin Elgar today. It's all about the Enigma Variations. Then maybe some Thomas Tallis.

Nimrod > Dorabella

Gran Torino is a legendary film though. So balances out the Smokin' Aces purchase.

Thing is, I'm not sure what sort of film it's meant to be. The title makes me think it's a "Night in the Museum" style comedy romp, but I'm not sure if I'm supposed to take it more seriously than that. Is it supposed to be like "Way of the Warrior" (Cowboys and Ninjas)? If so, I'm interested, but really, I liked Way of the Warrior's style more than its substance.

Killzone 3 - Done! Just trying to clear my backlog.

Hahaha. Animated one is weird. I wonder if he'll pop out of the background as much as I think he will? It'd be like a Who Framed Roger Rabbit version of Batman.

Battlelog is here to stay. It's got a few advantages over launching a client up front. Firstly, you can just have a battlelog tab open and see if any of your friends are online rather than having to boot the game and see who is playing (yes Steam does this too, but BF3's not *on* Steam yet <-- Not a confirmation or denial of Steam support). Secondly, you can manage your favourite servers, view your stats, see leaderboards, manage squads, add friends and people and what not all without booting the game. Thirdly, when you do eventually boot the game you don't have to sit through any obnoxious EA logo --> DICE logo --> etc. So far as "number of clicks" or "hassle" goes, I don't see what disadvantage Battlelog has over launching a client. Just go to Battlelog when you want to play BF3.

As of right now, you can't circumvent it (and it's an absolute clusterfuck as to how to launch it). You click the game in Origin, and on most other platforms, it would just launch right away, right? Wrong. On Origin, clicking BF3 instead takes you to the Battlelog, which is basically a stat tracking website. From there, you then click to join multiplayer, and once it finds an open game, THEN you can launch BF3. That better not make it into the full game, because that's a horrendous way to launch a game. I'm pretty sure you can just got to Battlelog and launch from there. No need to go through Origin.

Star Wars is not wholly owned IP. Battlefield on the other hand is. So while EA can do whatever the hell it wants with BF, with SW it's bound to an extent by what LA will allow for SW. Also worth noting that while it may not look like it, most of these services are interconnected.

EA seem to be quite pleased with the pre-orders for both this and BF3... Unless they do a Homefront and steal the most cancelled pre-order crown, both games should be successful by most measures.

Activate Smug Mode. Probably going to wait for Layton v Wright though. That's my system seller.

Certainly don't feel bad for them, but a 40% / $90 discount is pretty good really isn't it? *NOTE* I know that you can probably get the 3DS for less than $249 already, but assuming the discount will be in proportion to the actual price.